I am not saying that a Ramset is not a safe TOOL, but it is a tool and during a show it shouldn't be used. You would never run a table saw offstage just to get the sound
effect, so why would use a Ramset? There are plenty of products designed for
stage use that give the user just as realistic a sound, and can be used for their intended purpose safely. As has been posted in this thread, there are plenty of
stage firearms which when used properly are probably safer than the walk from the
stage door to your car.
So like those instances on this thread where someone was using a
stage weapon and someone got injured, right, got that, perfectly safe. I understand that the tool that is designed to look like a weapon (granted most of them seem to be older models) is the better choice (see my original post), yet I preferred the sound playback device which is even safer than that tool or the 1x4 (which could have its own dangers). You will notice that I stated that this was the last option if everything else was not possible. That is why I would use a Ramset.
It is just a question of proper use, and using a ramset for a sound
effect does not qualify as proper use. If you need the sound
effect and you are going to generate it offstage, you could use a
stage firearm in a place where you can control human traffic, which would the proper tool for the proper purpose. No need to use the improper tool for an improper purpose, especially since it won't save you any money (unless you owned the ramset).
By this, you mean that no actor should ever have a real hammer as a prop. Nor should a
stagehand use a hammer offstage to bang on anything to create a sound
effect because that does not qualify as its proper use. The actor cannot use it because it would likely void the
safety guidelines printed on the tool that it must be used with
safety goggles. Again, I said that the use of a Ramset would be if the other options are not available, not that it was cheaper, but that they are more accessible (available at big box hardware stores for sale and rent, I'm not sure that you could say the same thing about the approved
stage weapon).
That is like saying that a pneumatic framing nailer is safe unless you press it to someone's head.
You are saying that if someone is not defeating the
safety on the framing nailer (again by depressing the front of the tool, though less pressure is needed than for a Ramset) that the tool is unsafe? Yes, improper use of the framing nailer on some worksites has resulted in injuries, which can be said about the improper use of any tool. But if this is the case in your shop, I would say that you need an overhaul on your tools if their
safety features have been disabled. Does that mean that you also pull outriggers on your Genie lift and move them in the elevated position? Although, I must say, you probably just didn't think through your arguement and indeed do have safe practices and properly maintained tools in your theater, otherwise we wouldn't be having this discussion.
I don't know about you, but all of the gear that we use during a show is used for it's proper, intended purpose. You won't see any tool from the shop used in the wings of our
theatre during a show unless scenery or
props need to be fixed. Sure, the ASM backstage keeps a tool kit in their station, but as I mentioned, the tools only come out if something needs to be fixed (appropriate use). So, sure, if you had something that was falling off a concrete wall during a show then I think you could justify using a ramset during a show, but never for a purpose other than its intended purpose as a fastening device.
Well, that's because you neglected the first part of my statement when you quoted me. You neglected the fact that I was referring to the history of what we use in theater, not just
hand tools. Obviously
safety is the key to what we do, but in theater we practice many things that in Genaral Industry are deemed unsafe and we would be shut down if we were abiding by those same regulations. Historically, our industry has used many tools improperly in order to accomplish the task at
hand (in the safest way possible) and the industry is generally creating tools to replace the improper tools (i.e. reworking the chain motors to work upside down, building
truss to withstand the loads we put on them). If I am not mistaken, Foley artists (film, radio, and live theater) rarely use the actual objects to create sound effects but something that will make us believe that is the sound. By your definition, they should all be fined for improper use of tools or should not be allowed to do their work.
Our workspace has many hazards and so our workers need to be trained to practice safe procedures and that often includes the ability to make judgements on the safe use of equipment in an unintentional manner. If this were a simple matter, we wouldn't need this discussion. I assume that your
stage does not have a railing at the
edge to keep the actors from falling off? I also assume that you do not require hardhats at all times (even during performance) since what we have is considered a temporary structure that should require such
safety measures? These are examples regulated by General Industry standards that our industry knowingly disregards, but can be fined for (a theater was recently fined for an dancer falling off the front of the
stage because there wasn't a guard
rail, yes the DS
edge).
This is all besides the fact that use of any tool for other than its intended purpose can create a huge liability risk. What happens when something does go wrong, and even though you observed safe usage practices you still were ultimately using the tool for an improper purpose?
What? Because I am not actually fastening a board to concrete at that moment for construction purposes? Then please refer to my previous comment about the use of hammers in the theater. If you have an actor stand on a chair during a scene, that puts you in the same liability, so you better never direct (and yes I see that you do not
call yourself a director) a
play where anyone does anything against OSH Act since you would open yourself to fines and lawsuits (yes actors are considered employees and are protected by those regulations and of course I am speaking in a
broad stance since 26 states have their own regulations which are more strict that the federal regulations). You really are limiting yourself and your productions with the arguement you present.
To completely keep yourself not liable from theater related injuries, you would have to have absolutely no association with theater. Remember, Home Depot paid compensation to the victims families in the Rhode Island nightclub fire because they sold the
insulation that was used in the facility. Budweiser also made payments because they were indirect sponsors of the event. Even though the
insulation was used properly and the alcohol did not
block fire exits, they still were legal targets for lawsuit in that case.
What happens when you or someone else gets injured? Well, you get slapped with a lawsuit or you don't qualify for workman's
comp or your insurance doesn't pay your medical bill. Whereas if you were using the tool for it intended purpose and you or someone else got injured it would most likely be covered. By the same token, if using
stage firearms properly with proper supervision the liability is greatly decreased should there be any accident. Why? Because it is the proper tool used for the proper reason with proper
safety precautions in place.
You are right, the liability would be decreased, but not eliminated. You would still have to prove that the offender was properly trained in the use of the tool and was using it properly, but that still may not keep you from being liable. So you better stick with audio playback (at an appropriate sound
level so as not to damage anyone's hearing and keep the
speaker on the floor right at the patch
point so there are no cables on the floor,
etc.). We would have to refrain from using the 1x4 since that, by your definition, would be an improper use (of the material, not a tool) and has the potential of injury. If I'm not mistaken, most 1x4s that everyone is using are a softwood like pine and are more susceptible to breakage and splinters. Beyond that, the crushing force that could be applied to someones
foot would be trememdous and that would put you in the same lawsuit
category.
So, in short, I
stand by what I said, a ramset has no place in the wings during a show.
I appreciate that you do not feel comfortable with the use of a Ramset in your theater during shows and you have that right to control it there. For you to make a blanket statement for other theaters to not use it is improper (I am not speaking as a moderator who has ultimate control of what should be discussed). You can definitely voice your concerns, and they are quite welcome. I am happy that we are able to discuss the matter since there are more
safety concerns that are addressed in this fashion. I hope that noone ever feels intimidated in posting their concerns.
I am sure that you (and everyone else on this forum) will take to heart the continuing examples I have provided for you and the
safety of your employees as well as the concerns that you
express in this matter. I am sure that everyone here understands that there is a risk whenever using a powder actuated device, be it a tool like a Ramset or a
stage weapon, and that EVERY precaution needs to be met. Even though we put on "plays", we work in a serious business and horseplay should not be allowed in order to help prevent injuries.
Don't be shy now.
