How would you do this?

[Shawncfer]

So I'm working at a high school right now thats doing High School musical. (yeah I'm not to thrilled but it's paying :neutral: ). So they're trying to work on the ending basketball shot to make sure it's always perfect.

Im more of an electrician but my degree is still Theatre Tech so I've done some rigging which is more than the high schools theatre teacher. Well from the way she described it to me the way she wants to do it is to go to black out. Have one light on the basketball player and before he releases it turn the light off to blackout. Then have a special light on a basketball rigged from a baton that will be flown in and a special light will pop on for a second and pop off, then same thing will happen from a different baton with a ball at a different height. Then finally showing the court and someone will be above it to drop it in.

So I have two questions for you. First, whats the safest way to do this? She wants to deflate it and string some fishing line through it and then fill it with some kinda paste or something to keep it looking full even though it will have a whole in it. I don't know if thats the best idea but what do you think?

Second, does anybody have a better idea of how to go about this? Like a whole new idea all together?

 

[cpf]

I don't think filling it with paste would be required, a less messy solution would be tie a large-ish knot in some monofilament and use an air pump needle to force it inside the ball (the valve will seal around the filament). It will remain in the ball as long as it isn't pulled that hard. When it comes time to remove the string just (use pliers to) pull out the filament and return the ball to the athletic department.

 

[derekleffew]

...Second, does anybody have a better idea of how to go about this? Like a whole new idea all together?

The scenario you've described is never going to work. 1) You'll never get the timing right between the actor, LBO and flyperson(s). 2) The filament afterglow will ruin the effect.

I don't know the show, but here's how I would stage it: Have the actor shoot the ball offstage into the wings. Zero-count blackout as soon as the ball leaves his hands. Sound effect of applause, crowd cheering, etc. plays. A stagehand catches the ball in the wings.
(EDIT: Actually, you don't even need the blackout or the sound effects. The shooter's reaction, and whoever else is onstage, will sell the effect.)
OR,
Make the actor practice a lot, and use an oversized hoop.

 

[Footer]

Put the ball on a stick. Iris REALLY tight to the ball with a followspot. Follow the ball to the hoop. Blackout. Sound cue crowd cheering. Thats the way we did it both times when I did the show. I did this show the first year it was released to theatres and the disney reps that came to see the show were happy with it.

 

[porkchop]

Put the ball on a stick. Iris REALLY tight to the ball with a followspot. Follow the ball to the hoop. Blackout. Sound cue crowd cheering. Thats the way we did it both times when I did the show. I did this show the first year it was released to theatres and the disney reps that came to see the show were happy with it.

That's pretty much exactly how we did it on the Ice Show. We used UV lights so you could still see some of the players but the black stick didn't show up.

 

[kicknargel]

We did it just by going to blackout when he was about to release the ball. One thing I did to help was to have a light cue just before the moment that went to just a special on him done with a moving light. You can get a much quicker blackout with the shutter on a mover than with a conventional, so we didn't see him land back on the ground with the ball still in his hand.

 

[kicknargel]

Oh, and I would advise against the monofilament. It isn't appropriate for anything overhead that could hurt you. Sure, a B-Ball wouldn't be life-threatening, but if it fouled on something in the gallery and came down on someone it could sure cause an injury. If you need a rigging solutions I'd look a black 1/16" aircraft cable. And if you need to fill the ball, spray expanding foam (get the fireproof kind) should work.

 

[gafftapegreenia]

I believe when we did this in highschool he just shot the ball offstage and Blackout.

 

[avkid]

I believe when we did this in highschool he just shot the ball offstage and Blackout.

What fun is that?

 

[Shawncfer]

If you need a rigging solutions I'd look a black 1/16" aircraft cable. And if you need to fill the ball, spray expanding foam (get the fireproof kind) should work.

Thats what I suggested is air craft cable. I told her its a lot safer than fishing line. A couple years ago before I was a tech director here they had an incident where They have a frame out of 1X3s and then a peice of styrofoam attatched to the front and used Tieline to rig it. They thought it was no big deal but during a performance they were flying it out and it fell off. Luckily not hitting anyone but I keep trying to tell them they need to use aircraft cable. The director wont listen to me though :-/

but wither way, how would you rig the aircraft cable? I mean I know how with flats and other scenery but with a basketball? What if I cut a little slit in the top, fill it with the spray expanding foam stuff, and then at the top slip in the D-ring and Keeper and turn it so its horizontal inside the ball. Would that work?

 

[kicknargel]

Unfortunately, I think we're probably pushing it on the CB terms of service here. We can give ideas on how to pull off the effect but can't design a rigging setup. I will mention that no parts of your system should be purchased at a big box or hardware store. They need to be specifically rated for overhead lifting, made in the USA, stamped with a manufacturer and SWL. Sure, it's a small rig, but the nature of your questions indicates that you should find a non-flying solution, or hire a professional rigger.

Or, hm, could you use a foam rubber basketball with a great paint job? Then you could do anything!

 

[cdub260]

What if I cut a little slit in the top, fill it with the spray expanding foam stuff, and then at the top slip in the D-ring and Keeper and turn it so its horizontal inside the ball. Would that work?

No. This will not work. You'll end up with a misshapen lump with the skin of a ball. I don't recall why we needed a sphere, but we tried this trick at the Pageant a few years back because we thought it would save our sculpt department some time and effort. It didn't work. We ended up simply carving a sphere out of polystyrene. If you have to have a flown ball, a polystyrene sphere painted to look like a basketball will be far easier to work with than the real thing.

 

[Footer]

No. This will not work. You'll end up with a misshapen lump with the skin of a ball. I don't recall why we needed a sphere, but we tried this trick at the Pageant a few years back because we thought it would save our sculpt department some time and effort. It didn't work. We ended up simply carving a sphere out of polystyrene. If you have to have a flown ball, a polystyrene sphere painted to look like a basketball will be far easier to work with than the real thing.

Or cut the ball in half and glue it to another ball that has some type of substrate in it.

We can discuss how this can be rigged here, there is nothing against the TOS in that. I think the OP has showed he is capable of doing this correctly.

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I'm still a large supporter of a stick... if it is good enough to be used at a regional theatre that I worked with when this show first came out and is good enough for the Disney stamped ice show, I think it would be good enough for your show.

 

[Shawncfer]

So how do you use the stick? Does it go in the bottom of the ball? Is hung on the side or from the top? And does someone follow it with a follow spot?

 

[Footer]

So how do you use the stick? Does it go in the bottom of the ball? Is hung on the side or from the top? And does someone follow it with a follow spot?

Put the ball on the end of a 12' or so stick. When he shoots, he does not release the ball. A stagehand comes out in blacks with the ball and stick and essentially makes an arc towards the basket. A followspot with a VERY tight iris follows the ball. When the ball gets close to the basket, you douse out the spot... sound effect... everyone wins. If you have enough cheering going on in the background the entire time, the audience will get it. Yes, Troy is just that awesome. You just have to convince the audience. Now, I am going to go scrub my skin for the next few hours to try to get the HSM off my body.

Also, let us know how this show does. When I did HSM2 in 2009 it barely sold. It opened the same weekend the 3rd movie came out. This was at the same theatre that did the first one two years before and we ended up bringing the show back for a second run and it sold all of that too. I think kids are giving up on the HSM franchise. Now, Glee! the Musical!... that will sell... at least better then Spiderman, at least until Rent II (We all have bird flu) comes out.

 

[Catwalker]

Just have the actor practice the shot over and over again so they make it every time. (kidding)

 

[StradivariusBone]

I'm not sure if this would work, but what if you black out right as he jumps (just before the release), the actor doesn't actually shoot, but a moment after the blackout a spot or downlight hits the basket and a stagehand drops the basketball into the hoop from behind the basket. Applause, cheers, blackout.

This would require timing and a way to hide the tech behind the basket (and off the ground safely), but it'd give you the ball dropping in that you're looking for, assuming the tech doesn't drop it wrong.