Cutting chunks out of audio files?

[AlecIrwin]

Hello CB!
At the theater I work for, as the sound designer, the dance instructors for various shows give me CD's that are just regular MP3's and or WAV's, and often have instructions like "Cut out the first chorus and skip the interlude between the end in the second chorus." Which means essentially cutting a chunk out of the file. I have advised the instructors against having me do it, because it is very hard (if not downright impossible) to just "cut" an audio file like that and keep it flowing as the music was recorded. At least with the software in my budget, which is Audacity. I am also aware that my need for more experience could just be an element, but nonetheless I am curious what the experts have to say. Of course, I do my best with what I have, and think I have made them audio files that will work. Does anyone else have any better ideas or experience with this problem?

The basic point I have tried to make is, fading a song in or out early is easy as cake. Trying to just cut a section out of the center without skipping a beat and having all the instruments line up is not always possible. Is that correct?

 

[AudJ]

Never used audacity, but I do this all the time in pro-tools very easily, which I would imagine basic cut-and-paste functions would be similar. The trick is blowing up your view really large so you can only see you cut. This allows incredibly fine movement of the section. If audacity does not allow zoom, I'm sure there is something free that does.

The time consuming part is listening and adjusting it multiple times until it sounds right. If you have a lot of files, it could take a lot of time. In the studio, this would not be cheap to create a show like this, not because it is difficult, but because it is tedious. Single cut may only take 5 minutes, but it can add up fast.

It should be noted that copywrite is a consideration here...

 

[museav]

Which means essentially cutting a chunk out of the file. I have advised the instructors against having me do it, because it is very hard (if not downright impossible) to just "cut" an audio file like that and keep it flowing as the music was recorded. At least with the software in my budget, which is Audacity.

And to think we used to have to do any editing by actually physically cutting tape! For quick edits I believe Audacity allows you to find a zero point (or "find silence") and I usually zoom into the desired area of the clip and find appropriate zero points then delete the desired section. Then listen as see if it works and if not then try again with different points.

 

[Ric]

The big thing for any dance edits is to ensure that you 'keep the beat' when you do an edit.
It's easy to cut the part out, but joining it together requires some understanding of timing.
Count it out loud, tap your foot, clap; anything that works, to ensure your beat hasn't slipped or advanced.
If it's out it can cause dancers to lose their place pretty quickly!!

Most dance based on modern music is pretty straight forward as it's 4/4 (rock music) or 12/8 or 3/4 (waltz etc.) timing, so you can often swap it half a bar and it still sounds ok, but is wrong.

I use Cubase or Wavelab, and both of those allow you to zoom in to a waveform very easily.
I've not used Audacity but if it can cut and paste onto a separate track it should be easy.

Slide the edited items to a time or marker, where the 2 section overlap visually.
Zoom in to get a reasonable view of the volume envelope & you should see beats (drums are usually easiest).
Overlap the beats so that you can see they're at the same time/marker.
Have fade in & fade outs on each section to smooth out the transistion.
Listen repeatedly to the overlaps & slide the section(s) again, adjusting fade in/outs shorter or longer, as required to get a smooth change.

Hope that helps!

I found a youtube clip of beat matching with Audacity; perhaps it may help!

 

[Ric]

give me CD's that are just regular MP3's and or WAV's,

And always remind them that MP3's or iTunes downloads rarely sound good on a decent playback system such as a Theatre will have!!
Converting them to WAV's or burning them to CD won't improve the original quality.
Early warning can save a lot of issues at concert time.

 

[AlecIrwin]

Makes sense! Thank you for all of the responses! I edited them the best I could and gave the CD to the instructors, haven't heard any complaints so I imagine it worked ok!!!

 

[hosko]

For editing songs where you want to loop a section or cut a section I have always used ableton live with very good results. They now have an intro deal for $99

 

[themuzicman]

In high school I made a good bit of cash on the side cutting music for many many dancers and ice skaters. If a dance recital is coming in and just throwing you music and expecting you to cut it for free, they are crazy. I found a lot of dance dads and local school music teachers who were doing it for $200-$300 a pop who had no real training in how to use any of the software and realized that it was quick easy cash. If you can do it well, it's usually fairly quick and I never charged the outrageous fees that those guys charged (reasonably, $50 for a few hours of my time was well worth it then and is still all I could honestly charge to a local dance company). They are having you do it to side-step their usual methods of having to source it out and pay. --- though that could all be unfounded conjecture.

That being said, remember the golden triangle - quick, inexpensive, and good. You can pick any two, but you're not going to get all three.

I never used anything but Audacity, got a few open source plugins to help smooth things over, and was always able to get good results (never a fan of ridiculous jump cuts in dancers music!). Even now that I have Logic and ProTools, I find Audacity gets the job done for a lot of applications.