Irideon Moving Lights

macsound

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First of all, amazing deal on some brand new AR500 Exteriors. I presume these were liquidated from DisneyWorld storage as they were super common for castle illumination along with Martin Exterior 300 and 600s and are just now being replaced with colorsource pars.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-Irideo...591?_trksid=p2349526.m4383.l4275.c20#viTabs_0

Real question and conversation for here, who misses Irideon AR50s. Essentially a small, single yoke arm VL500.
I never got to use any personally besides demo units in showrooms, but I loved the idea of their size for corporate stuff, to stand on stage and that they were so uniquely shaped.

I feel like now, if I want a moving light that's less than 50lbs, its not going to be professional and almost impossible to get CMY.

Since I feel like we're all theatre designers here, I feel like something like the AR50 would have tons of usability in todays environment, but manufacturers are so focused on Viper sized fixtures, the dim end of the line defaults to DJs.
Thoughts?
(edit to add image, couldn't figure out how to make it reasonable size, removed image.)
 

Mac Hosehead

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I remember the small Irideons, but I don't think I ever saw them in a stage setting. Color was made with Vari-lite radial blades so, yes, you won't this again. Many moving parts in a compact space.

The AR500s typically needed an interface to work with DMX but I thought there was a firmware version that did not need it.
 

Pie4Weebl

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I think you have some outdated ideas about what the lower end of moving lights looks like these days. In particular I would suggest looking at the Elation Fuze moving lights for a really cool smaller wash light. Of course I am also a big fan of the Chauvet Maverick and Rouge lines. Our R2 Washes have been used not only on rock and roll gigs, but on corporate events and even for an opera!
 

RonHebbard

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I think you have some outdated ideas about what the lower end of moving lights looks like these days. In particular I would suggest looking at the Elation Fuze moving lights for a really cool smaller wash light. Of course I am also a big fan of the Chauvet Maverick and Rouge lines. Our R2 Washes have been used not only on rock and roll gigs, but on corporate events and even for an opera!
@Pie4Weebl Huh?
Toodleoo!
Ron Hebbard
 
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Pie4Weebl

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@Pie4Weebl Huh?
Toodleoo!
Ron Hebbard
I was responding to the second half of OPs post:
"I feel like now, if I want a moving light that's less than 50lbs, its not going to be professional and almost impossible to get CMY.

Since I feel like we're all theatre designers here, I feel like something like the AR50 would have tons of usability in todays environment, but manufacturers are so focused on Viper sized fixtures, the dim end of the line defaults to DJs.
Thoughts?"
 
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RonHebbard

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I was responding to the second half of OPs post:
"I feel like now, if I want a moving light that's less than 50lbs, its not going to be professional and almost impossible to get CMY.

Since I feel like we're all theatre designers here, I feel like something like the AR50 would have tons of usability in todays environment, but manufacturers are so focused on Viper sized fixtures, the dim end of the line defaults to DJs.
Thoughts?"
@Pie4Weebl Sorry @Pie4Weebl When I posted "Huh" my screen was showing your post as a totally blank black screen. My UPS had carried me through but possibly the momentary lapse in power had upset my net provider's pedestal in the street outside our building. Refreshing my page has now revealed your post.
Toodleoo!
Ron Hebbard (Near blind computer 'phobe')
 

gafftaper

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Yeah Rogue 2's are cheap, 20lbs, quite powerful, low energy consumption and have been out on lots of tours proving they are a legitimate durable product too. It's great to have an old fixture that you know and love, but there are some great new products out at reasonable prices
 

macsound

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True, lots of RGB or RGBW LED source smaller moving lights.
Any feedback about Martin Rush MH7 Hybrid?

What I love about arc source is their relative consistency through colors to the eye and on camera. I notice lots of colors that LED fixtures can make are invisible or drive cameras nuts, so I tend to not fill a rig with them. This is equally important for me in convention and theatre productions because they all have press photos and video taken and it's nuts to see how cameras see a face lit with a Lustr S4 vs incandescent S4 vs VL2500 vs VLX.
Suffice to say, I'm ok with single color LED frontlight, Colorsource for color downs, but otherwise it's arc source and gelled LED or incandescent for me.
 

StradivariusBone

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I'm in the midst of this now and looking for a sub $3k ML I'm finding a challenge to get something with color mixing. It's pushing me to look backward at the MAC 2K's because it has everything I want in a price that I want, but I'd be buying a 10+ year old fixture. Not to mention figuring out the power would be a thing.

However the R2 wash is appealing at the price point simply because I could get more fixtures, but I lose GOBO's in lieu of color mixing. I haven't played with MLs much in a theatre environment, would a wash with good color and wide zoom trump a profile with dichroic filters and GOBOs for what I'd most likely use it for?

I can see a few places where have an on demand GOBO rotator would be a nice touch, but is it a deal-breaker with how advanced the moving washes seem to be getting? Also, how does the R2 hold up against tungsten front wash? We already have a full setup of LED downlight via Blizzard RokBoxes and that works well to add color as needed. It seems like a lot of the newer products out right now are changing the parameters of what one might look for in automated lighting.
 
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sk8rsdad

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Wash vs spot is a classic debate. A spot with a frost will work as a wash light. A wash light can never be a spot, but it will be a better wash than a spot with a frost.

Have a look at used Clay Paky Alpha Profiles or 700 HPEs. They can often be found for under $3K and work well for a mixed use venue. The 300 is a good option too. It is the same chassis and feature set as the 700 and the output is exceptional for a 300W fixture. The profile has a wider zoom but you give up the static gobo wheel to get framing shutters.

PRG has some profiles in Orlando. If the picture is from one of the fixtures and not a stock photo I would steer clear - the fixture is missing it's display and mainboard and may have been through some heavy weather.

https://prg-proshop.com/products/item/1564/lighting/moving-lights/clay-paky-alpha-profile-700
https://prg-proshop.com/products/item/1264/lighting/moving-lights/clay-paky-300-spot

That said, we may have reached the tipping point on discharge lamps now that LED is everywhere so operating costs and longevity may be a factor if the plan is to get a decade or more of use out of them. It might be better to spend more for a new fixture.
 

StradivariusBone

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Strad: you know they have a profile in the R2 line, right?

In fact, I gather they have a profile, and something even spiffier and sharper, but I forget what they call it.
Yup, but you only get dichroic colors on a wheel. It doesn't do CMY. I was looking at that one, but is it worth picking up the GOBOs and losing the ability to have fine control on the color? The Mavericks I think have CMY, but that's a bit beyond what I'm wanting to spend ATM.

The real game changer is going to be a point source LED that does RGBAWUV LMNOP with a twist of lime, etc. Probably have to be liquid-cooled too.
 

macsound

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I think you're all getting at what I'm feeling.
Small Spot fixtures seem to only have a color wheel. Wash fixtures have an RGB LED source.

I'd be fine with an LED source if it had actual CMY for color, a douser for dimming and the LED was truly just an arc replacement instead of trying to change the whole operation of what we've come to expect from a moving light.
And have a product line that spans sizes. Like the Alpha line did. 300, 575, 700 and 1200.
 

sk8rsdad

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CMY color mixing and mechanical dimming makes no sense for an LED fixture. The whole idea of moving to LED is efficiency. Using a white source and filtering out color is the wrong approach. Putting a mechanical douser in front of an electronically dimmable light source is also silly.

Many manufacturers are doing it in order rush a LED fixture to market but that's a transitional solution and not where the industry is going.

The HES Sola product line or the Robe DL series are a couple of examples of the way forward for LED MLs.

The truly radical digital lighting age isn't quite here yet. It wouldn't surprise me if there's a next-generation moving yoke laser projector similar to the HES DL.HD on somebody's planning table. Imagine image mapping the whole stage and illuminating individual actors precisely with no spill (or maybe just their pinky finger) as they move.
 

macsound

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While using color filters in front of an LED source doesn't make the most sense efficiency-wise, as a designer, I'm concerned about getting the best color for my situation and so far, color mixing LEDs can't do that anywhere as well as CMY glass can.
For dimming, there are very few LED sources I have experienced that can dim, strobe and fade in the very controllable and predictable way a slice of graduated glass and metal can.

As a theatrical lighting (and sound) designer, I believe technology can make our lives easier and better. Moving ERS fixtures have done amazing things for flexibility and economical use of electricity but sometimes still there's no replacement for a Source Four and specific gel color.
 

StradivariusBone

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CMY color mixing and mechanical dimming makes no sense for an LED fixture. The whole idea of moving to LED is efficiency. Using a white source and filtering out color is the wrong approach. Putting a mechanical douser in front of an electronically dimmable light source is also silly.
I think this approach is present now just simply because it's hard to fit enough white LED's on a stick small enough to function as a point source for the optics required. If you start adding RGB to the mix and keep it that small you're going to lose intensity or increase heat. Not to mention you then have several light origin points which would affect your GOBO projections. A glass tube can deal with it, but diodes would fail, at least that's my guess. The ones that do have RGB are way more expensive, but I'm thinking in another 10 years it will be a different story. Maybe we'll all be rocking media servers and LED projectors on moving yokes.
 
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