Control/Dimming Running multiple shows on one console?

[RGJones]

Hey everyone,

I've got an interesting idea/problem that I'm having trouble coming up with a solution for. I've got a Net3 network that I'm using to control equipment spread out over a large area and it has been working great, mostly some realtime cues for on and off as well as a few effects here and there. This is all being controlled off of an ETC Element at the moment and will continue to be controlled off of the element at least for awhile.

My dilemma is that I want to add two timecode controlled shows and have them run off of the same console. I'll admit that I have pretty much created this problem but it helps us out to have everything running off of one console. I believe I've figured out enough that I could make it work if I started from scratch. For example; write all the cues with different numbers (show 1-cues 1-100, show 2-cues 301-400, etc.), have different event lists firing the different cues, have each list pull its timecode from the separate sources, patch everything going to its proper output universe/node, etc. However, I already have show files for each show, so how do I not start from scratch?

Unless I'm missing something merging shows is out of the question because both shows are using the same cue number range, and the patches are occupying the same range as well, plus the event lists. So is there a way to basically batch process the files and renumber everything, and repatch? Or do I need to go in and do it all manually?

Hopefully there's something easy I just don't know about!

 

[Footer]

You can't on the element, you can only have one cue list running at a time on that console. You need an Ion or larger.

 

[RGJones]

I've got an Ion and a Gio, they're used for shows at the moment, but I can look into getting another Ion for this use.

I didn't even think about the cue lists needing to be separate at first, but duh.

So now if I do this on an Ion, is there any easy way of transferring the existing show files into a single show file on the Ion? Like putting each file in its own cue and event list, modifying the patch (like shifting the entire patch up to another universe), etc? I imagine getting the cues into different cue lists is easy, its the patch that I'm worried about, although at worst I'll have to redo it manually, but these shows aren't many channels.

 

[chawalang]

You patching won't be an issue, you patch whatever you would like accordingly to a particular universe. You just save different shows under different cue stacks in separate executer faders. My recommendation would be to use a different page per show to ease confusion of what is what. You can have separate cue stacks written to various auxiliary things like house lights, hazers and the like. Those auxiliary things would be common on every page but have a 1 cue stack per page that is a specific show to that page..

A good example I can give for this was when I was on cruise ships. On a seven day cruise we would have a different production show every night. Some would be huge shows with 1,000 cues each controlled by time code and some were simple fly on acts that had a few looks that you would cycle through on a executer fader. Each page was for a different show but I still had faders that were common on every page that were for hazers, Low fog, house lights, emergency lights etc. The same patch was used for every show, same lighting network, same rig as well, just a different programmed show each night.

 

[porkchop]

I'm a little confused. Are your two different shows going to be running simultaneously? If so, are they going to be running off the same timecode source? That seems problematic at best. If not, to my knowledge your console can't take multiple timecode inputs at the same time. If you're only going to have one show running at a time (even if the dates overlap) what prevents you from just reloaded the show you're about to do into the console as necessary?
Or after reading your second post, is it the situation that you have an existing system on the Element that knows nothing about either of your shows and you want to merge the show files that you have created elsewhere onto that Element? If that's the case, IMHO it sounds fiddly and time consuming to do for minimal gain. If something goes wrong, you're going to want a board op there to deal with it, and if you've got a console set up in the theatre already that's going to be the fastest and easiest way I'd think.

 

[RGJones]

I'm a little confused. Are your two different shows going to be running simultaneously? If so, are they going to be running off the same timecode source? That seems problematic at best. If not, to my knowledge your console can't take multiple timecode inputs at the same time. If you're only going to have one show running at a time (even if the dates overlap) what prevents you from just reloaded the show you're about to do into the console as necessary?
Or after reading your second post, is it the situation that you have an existing system on the Element that knows nothing about either of your shows and you want to merge the show files that you have created elsewhere onto that Element? If that's the case, IMHO it sounds fiddly and time consuming to do for minimal gain. If something goes wrong, you're going to want a board op there to deal with it, and if you've got a console set up in the theatre already that's going to be the fastest and easiest way I'd think.

Yes, two different shows, running at the same time, with two different time code sources. On EOS family you can give each event list a separate timecode source, so I know that much is possible.

Yes these are two shows that have, in the past, been run on separate elements and now I want to combine them onto a single console. I'm working on getting the console to be an Ion instead of an Element as it seems that would help this situation.

Technically we're talking about three shows, the one that is currently on the element (show A), show B (created on an element), and show C (again created on an element). Show A has no timecode and is just two cues, all executed by realtime events. Show B has timecode and is around 100 cues with 70ish channels, all executed by SMPTE events. Show B has timecode and again is around 100 cues with 30ish channels, all executed by SMPTE events.

The biggest thing is that these "shows" are not shows in the traditional sense. Yes they are shows and have timecode executed cues and almost everything else a show has, but none of them have a board op, any manually executed cues or any performers. Having them on a single console actually gives us the ability to have someone near the console should something go wrong, otherwise the consoles are half a mile away and buried in a closet.

My backup plan is to run three consoles on the network, each with their own show, all sitting in the same physical location (not near the show), but I'd like to figure out a way to streamline this. I know it will take some work to get it up and running, but the benefits in this situation are unique and helpful to us.

 

[RGJones]

I realize I didn't say what I needed help with in that last post.

Now that I know I can't run the multiple cue lists on the element this is more about how to take my three show files and combining them into one. Obviously I could do it all manually but that would be pretty time consuming.

So for the cues, can I load each show into separate cue lists on an Ion?

For the event lists executing the cues, can I load these into separate event lists on the Ion?

For the patch, since they all start at address 1/1 (only one universe for each show) right now could I load an entire patch into another universe? Like say move show B's patch to start at 42/1?


I realize this is complicated and I might just have to suck it up and manually redo it all, so if thats the best option then its ok.

 

[tdrga]

I realize I didn't say what I needed help with in that last post.

Now that I know I can't run the multiple cue lists on the element this is more about how to take my three show files and combining them into one. Obviously I could do it all manually but that would be pretty time consuming.

So for the cues, can I load each show into separate cue lists on an Ion?

For the event lists executing the cues, can I load these into separate event lists on the Ion?

For the patch, since they all start at address 1/1 (only one universe for each show) right now could I load an entire patch into another universe? Like say move show B's patch to start at 42/1?


I realize this is complicated and I might just have to suck it up and manually redo it all, so if thats the best option then its ok.

You can merge all three show cue lists into one showfile. Go to File > Merge, pick your source showfile, then click the Advanced button, then chose the Cues button. Fill in the Start and End cue numbers, then put the cuelist that you want to put them in as the Target (i.e. 3/1 for cuelist three, cue one).

I believe the same process will work for the event lists.

To move a patch universe, go to patch by Address. Select 1/1 through 1/512 to grab the entire first universe and hit [Copy To] twice (puts Move To on command line) then choose the destination address (42/1 would be starting at address 1 in universe 42).

If you download the EOS Nomad offline software, you can do all of this on your computer to test things out at your leisure.

-Todd