Ban LEDs ??

[JD]

As a large proponent of LED lighting for use in general area lighting (house lights) as well as domestic lighting, I was curious when I found a site called "Ban LED Lighting." ( https://banledlighting.wordpress.com/ ) I figured it was some nut-case site of misinformation, but I always like to hear the other side of issues, so I gave it a look.
Many of the topics raised I think we are all aware of, such as; Poor dimming, minimum loads, CRI, heat issues, Toxic issues, etc.. Still, there were a number of topics that were interesting, such as; Recall information, shock hazards, fire hazards, RF pollution, etc. Bottom line, I am still a proponent of LED lighting and any reasonable installation would take all these factors into consideration. I have some debate in my mind regarding toxic contributions as they are far better (less toxic) than CLF lamps, but more so than an old incandescent lamp. I think that LEDs would fit more into the category of cell phone and other general electronic recycling. I would give the articles a read, although like myself, you will probably find yourself dismissing most of the points raised.

 

[Judge]

Valid points or not, LED lighting is not going away. There is/will be a plague of shonky unworthy and horrible domestic LED things from China that will come in various shades of disappointment. Reputable companies like ETC will work hard to ensure that their stuff works well, is safe and has as minimal a toxic footprint as possible I am sure and hopefully will lead the way to others to do the same.
In the UK its becoming almost impossible to rent any kind of discharge moving head wash - they are all LED based now. Luckily can still get PARs and Source 4s.

 

[jstroming]

Honestly I hate the look of LED for real, dirty rock shows. I was at House of Blues LA the other night and the entire rig was non-LED. So refreshing.

 

[Judge]

Yes, I know what you mean. Actually, as an LED and as a punter at shows I dislike them. But they were not designed for us. They were designed for accountants. All the major hire companies love them because there are less lamps to burn out, less moving parts to maintain. Tour accountants love them because there is less electricity to use and less truck space to rent. Riggers like them because they weigh less. As an actual lighting fixture they have no redeeming features.

 

[BillConnerFASTC]

Yes, I know what you mean. Actually, as an LED and as a punter at shows I dislike them. But they were not designed for us. They were designed for accountants. All the major hire companies love them because there are less lamps to burn out, less moving parts to maintain. Tour accountants love them because there is less electricity to use and less truck space to rent. Riggers like them because they weigh less. As an actual lighting fixture they have no redeeming features.

I can't speak to all LED units for entertainment lighting but the ones we specify - like Source4 an PL units - are a bit bigger and weigh considerably more than their quartz ancestors. We have had to upsize rigging for LEDs.

One of the problems is the LEDs I saw last week are much improved over the month before, and each month or two before that.

I'm afraid its like the transition from black iron pipe to copper, now copper to plastic, for plumbers; or maybe how oil painters reacted to acrylic ( fine arts or house painters - take your choice) or many other transitions.

 

[Judge]

Hi Bill
Good points about ETC stuff. I was really thinking about wash lights. For example a Robe 600LED has replaced a Robe Colorwash 700e - weights 10kg and 30kg respectively.
We are still really at a stage of early adoption I guess and hopefully in a few years time we will be looking at an entirely different animal. Maybe then I will prefer LED lightsource to discharge or tungsten. These things do take time and some transitions take longer than others to be solid and convincing. I took years before I changed from 35mm photography to digital, and before I replaced my Trinitron monitors with LCD screens because the shiny new digital stuff was really rubbish. I was quite happy to see carburettors replaced with fuel injection though.

 

[BillConnerFASTC]

And I was comparing quartz to LED, not discharge and color changing to LED. We all have different experiences and focus, which greatly affect suitability and opinion of products.

I will say, comparing a ETC Source 4 with a 750, an ETC LED series 2, and all three current varieties of the Altman Phoenix LED profiles, I was impressed about how far things have come - and how much more difficult choices are. All of those are good choices for some things done well, and none do all things well. If you want a >>>RED<<< wash from foh, hard to beat the Phoenix RGBA. The ETC does the "lustre" pallet of colors and faces extremely well next to the quartz. And none of the LED attempts quite do the quartz red shift as well as - well - quartz.

I don't think we're returning to an all quartz world soon and I hope I live long enough to see what comes after LED and what it can do. The plasma source never seemed to quite make it but I'm sure teh next break through - whether plasma, LED, or other base - is on the drawing boards or in someones shop as a test already.

A bunch of respected scientists predicted that the first person to live to 1000 years of age is already born. Further, people under 40 should expect to live a couple of 100 years. That something will replace LEDs is an easy prediction next to that. (Tip of the day - people under 40 - heed your dentist telling you to floss. In my 60's, I was amused that my dentist "fixed" a problem with a product that - printed om the product label - claims to be dentistry's duct tape.)

 

[JD]

What comes next....
You know, I was thinking about this. Maybe a multi-technology fixture. We know LED does blue great. Green, pretty good, but you're right, red is the problem for LEDs and Discharge. Imagine a low wattage fixture that uses different physics for different parts of the spectrum. Anyway, I wonder if anybody has though about going down that road. I am tempted to set up a rig and do G and B with LED, and use conventionals for the R just for the heck of it!