Hi everyone, I have a couple noobish dimmer questions. I don't know much about mechanical aspects of dimmers because, I have never needed to worry about them. We have a Leviton/Colortran i98 rack with 48 dimmers.
Questions 1, Why are the channels spaced out so much? Not just 1, 2, 3 and so on, but the channel number sheet has 1 through 16 as the foh spotlights, and like, channel, 167 as houselights row 7 etc.? I'm pretty sure each fixture we own only has one channel, intensity.
About adding a new fixture.
Our dimmers are pre-wired, just need to plug into the fly bars above the stage, and if all dimmers arent pre-wired I would have to..well, I would have to call the person who desighned the theatre about that, because the dimmer is against the wall with no access to the rear of the dimmers. And all wires pipped in through the top.
Anyways, Fixtures have not been plugged into different channels, or new fixtures added in..wlel, since the theatre was built I am assuming, will I need to be careful with the specific dimmer or anything? It not being using for so long? Or will it be fine?
Because we are planning on getting at least 10 new fixtures soon.
How to dimmers really work?
For some reason I am getting a picture like,
Going from the DMX outlit were I plug the board into, that outlet goes to dimmer 1, out of dimmer one to dimmer 2, and so on to 48, so they are all daisy chained, and a fixture is plugged into any dimmer. But what about a DMX light, like a moving head or a LEDeffect? What would I do with it? Because we are thinking of one or two DMX lights aswell, but I really dont know what to do with them. I would call in the desighner for somethign like this, but if you guys culd help me, I wouldnt need to bother him.
Thanks : )
I dont know much about dimmers because since I got onboard in the schools theatre, it was pretty much set it and forget it, you know?
DMX (on a normal system) travels from the back of the board to a dimmer rack (big refrigerator sized unit) the dimmer rack then takes that signal and tells what cell (dimmer) gets turned on and to what percent...Then the power is sent from the dimmer rack to the outlet where you plug your light in...
for automated fixtures, the DMX signals get sent from the back of the lighting console directly to the intelligent light, then you would give the fixture Starting Address (channel)
I wouldnt think its the channels that are spaced out, its the dimmers that are spaced out...but on a ETC board you can patch dimmers to different channels...
Hi everyone, I have a couple noobish dimmer questions. I don't know much about mechanical aspects of dimmers because, I have never needed to worry about them. We have a Leviton/Colortran i98 rack with 48 dimmers.
Questions 1, Why are the channels spaced out so much? Not just 1, 2, 3 and so on, but the channel number sheet has 1 through 16 as the foh spotlights, and like, channel, 167 as houselights row 7 etc.? I'm pretty sure each fixture we own only has one channel, intensity.
Is your dimmer rack one unit, or several units daisy-chained together? If it's multiple units, then it's to do with your DMX dial-up. Each individual pack (usually 6 or 12 channels) has a starting DMXaddress which is set-able to whatever you choose - our houselightdimmer pack is set to 156 so that it's clear of our stage packs. If your dimmer rack is all one unit, then the houselights have been softpatched at the desk; what that means is that channel 167 on the desk is not necessarily controlling dimmer 167, it has been set to control another dimmer. Look for a menu on the desk called "PATCH". Often in theatres which are permanently hard-patched (like yours) I softpatch so that all my warm generals, cool generals, backlight colours etcetc are in order on the desk, rather than being distributed according to what dimmer I plugged them into.
About adding a new fixture.
Our dimmers are pre-wired, just need to plug into the fly bars above the stage, and if all dimmers arent pre-wired I would have to..well, I would have to call the person who desighned the theatre about that, because the dimmer is against the wall with no access to the rear of the dimmers. And all wires pipped in through the top.
Anyways, Fixtures have not been plugged into different channels, or new fixtures added in..wlel, since the theatre was built I am assuming, will I need to be careful with the specific dimmer or anything? It not being using for so long? Or will it be fine?
Because we are planning on getting at least 10 new fixtures soon.
You should be fine. Just don't run the channel to full right away (which you shouldn't do anyway!) - run it at 30% for a while to let the lamp warm up.
How to dimmers really work?
For some reason I am getting a picture like,
Going from the DMX outlit were I plug the board into, that outlet goes to dimmer 1, out of dimmer one to dimmer 2, and so on to 48, so they are all daisy chained, and a fixture is plugged into any dimmer. But what about a DMX light, like a moving head or a LEDeffect? What would I do with it? Because we are thinking of one or two DMX lights aswell, but I really dont know what to do with them. I would call in the desighner for somethign like this, but if you guys culd help me, I wouldnt need to bother him.
You're pretty much right on the dimmers - they take DMX from the desk, and then power from a power supply - the lamps get their powers from the dimmers. DMX fixtures (LEDs, scrollers, movers etc) don't get plugged into a dimmer; you daisy-chain the DMX out of the dimmers (have a look - there's probably a socket marked DMXTHRU or DMX OUT) into your fixture, which you set to a unique DMXaddress - a different address to the dimmeraddress - each DMXfixture needs its own address so it can be controlled individually. You then plug the fixture into HARD POWER - NOT a dimmer. DMX controls the dimming - plug a moving light into a dimmer and it will not be happy. What sort of DMX lights are you thinking of - I thought we'd got you to realise that moving heads are not what you need?
How to dimmers really work?
For some reason I am getting a picture like,
Going from the DMX outlit were I plug the board into, that outlet goes to dimmer 1, out of dimmer one to dimmer 2, and so on to 48, so they are all daisy chained, and a fixture is plugged into any dimmer.
I think what you're saying here is that each dimmer receives DMX directly from the unit upstream of it. The dimmers themselves never actually see DMX. In most cases the DMX from your board travels to a control board (in my rack it's the control server). This board translates the DMX, taking the value for each channel and sending it to the right dimmer in the form of a control voltage.
Remember that the channels on the board do not necessarily control the circuit with their number on stage, the two things are not same. That's where patching comes in, which kiwietechgirl alluded to.
MillburyAuditorium, I think you'd benefit tremendously from reading a textbook on stage lighting. Many people recommend Designing with Light, by J. Michael Gillette. You needn't buy the latest revision; the 1997 edition is available used here for as low as $3.50.
In re-reading the original post, I think there may be some confusion about channels -vs- dimmers ( and by extension circuits) and Devices. Not being clear and using the correct names makes it harder to understand the question.
A Circuit is what you plug your fixture into and is connected to a dimmer. It sounds like that in your theatre the dimmers are hard wired into the circuits in the house ( called dimmer per circuit) so the dimmer number and the circuit number are the same.
A channel is a concept of the control console. Because it is convenient to have the first slider on your board control (say) the Down Left area light, all modern control consoles have the ability to associate a control channel with any dimmer number.
A device is the think that is being controlled by a DMX cable. It might be a dimmer rack ( but not usually a single dimmer) - or a moving light, a scroller, or a fog maching.
It is unclear from your post if you are asking 'Why are channels spread out so much' if you are asking about dimmers or channels. It it is dimmers, the answer is 'Because the installer / architect wired it up that way and live with it'. It it is channels it is 'Because whoever patched the board decided it made sense and you can change it to be whatever you want'.
Read the manual about how to patch dimmers to circuits and things may become clearer. I expect that if you go to the FOH position, you will see outlets that are labeled with the dimmer number. You want to find or make a chart showing the location of every circuit/dimmer number in the theatre. It could be that you have two outlets with the same dimmer number. This means that they both are controlled by the same dimmer. When you are deciding where to hang a light, you can plug it into any unused dimmer, and assign that to any channel you wish.
It also sounds like, in your house, that you don't have very many dimmers. If you plug two fixtures into the same dimmer, they will always run at the same intensity. You need to think carefully about what lights you can run together, and which ones you must have separate. For example, if you have two fixtures on each area from front of house, you would like to control each fixture separately. If you don't have enough dimmers, you might put both of the fixtures on the same dimmer. You also need to find out the capacity of each dimmer ( usually 2400 watts) and make sure that you do not put more load on the dimmer than it is rated for. (IE you can't plug 6 500 watt fixtures into a single dimmer).
As to the DMX question. DMX is the standard control protocol to control Devices. A device is typically a dimmer pack ( not a single dimmer) a scroller, or a moving light. DMX cables typically do daisy chain from device to device, but (in the case of a dimmer pack with multiple dimmers - which I think is your situation) not from dimmer to dimmer.
There is mention of cleaning out your dimmers above. While this is done regularly in the industry it can EASILY KILL YOU, if you don't know what you are doing. This is something that should only be done by a trained adult technician following proper safety protocals. Never by an unsupervised student. If there's anything you can vacum without opening up the dimmer rack go for it but NEVER open or pull anything out without a trained adult technician IN THE ROOM instructing you.
I second Gafftaper on this one, getting shocked in there is going to do more than make your hair stand on end, it will likely burn you to a crisp. If your going to go in there, make sure there is a qualified person (preferably a spark), and consider shutting down the main service to the dimmers, if you can do that without destroying things. Just dont mess around with electricity.
An i96 rack holds 48 dimmermodules; each module has two dimmers. So the first question is, are you counting modules or dimmers? (Note that some modules are 2 units high, so the rack would only support 24 of the larger modules.) Also, what type of modules do you have? (Should be a label on the front.)
As for the spacing, it may be soft-patched in the board, or it may be soft-patched in the dimmer rack. The i-series dimmers allow for each dimmer to be assigned to whatever DMXaddress you want. This assignment was probably done by the installer, but it can possibly changed by a knowledgeable user. (You shouldn't try this yourself, and it may require special software.) So, if your board is patched 1:1, then the odd sequencing is likely due to patching in the rack itself.
As for DMX routing, the control module in the dimmer rack reads the DMX stream, and then directly controls all the dimmers based on the patching. The DMX is hard-wired to the rack, there's no output from it to drive other lights. To drive DMX-controlled instruments, you would need to use a 2nd output from your board, or use a DMX splitter if your board only has one output.
For maintenance, according to the manual, the door filters should be removed and washed (and completely dry before reinstalling.) The air intakes and outlets should be vacuumed. If you can, do this with power to the rack off. As mentioned by others, you should not be opening anything or removing any modules for cleaning.
As for the spacing, it may be soft-patched in the board, or it may be soft-patched in the dimmer rack. The i-series dimmers allow for each dimmer to be assigned to whatever DMXaddress you want. This assignment was probably done by the installer, but it can possibly changed by a knowledgeable user. (You shouldn't try this yourself, and it may require special software.) So, if your board is patched 1:1, then the odd sequencing is likely due to patching in the rack itself.
I believe that both the ETC Sensor+ and Strand C21 racks allow some form of patching. It's particularly applicable when there are multiple control sources for a rack (such as console + architectural system.)
-College students should be trained to do standard dimmer maintenance independently.
-High School students, in a school with a trained adult, should hopefully have the opportunity to assist with dimmer maintenance... but never without supervision.
-Although it's completely safe when done correctly, a mistake could be fatal. So for the safety of our younger members, we do not allow the discussion of how to clean dimmers here on CB. If you don't know what you are doing, call a trained professional.
Just to clarify:
-Although it's completely safe when done correctly, a mistake could be fatal. So for the safety of our younger members, we do not allow the discussion of how to clean dimmers here on CB. If you don't know what you are doing, call a trained professional.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MillburyAuditorium Hi everyone, I have a couple noobish dimmer questions. I don't know much about mechanical aspects of dimmers because, I have never needed to worry about them. We have a Leviton/Colortran i98 rack with 48 dimmers.
Questions 1, Why are the channels spaced out so much? Not just 1, 2, 3 and so on, but the channel number sheet has 1 through 16 as the foh spotlights, and like, channel, 167 as houselights row 7 etc.? I'm pretty sure each fixture we own only has one channel, intensity.
Is your dimmer rack one unit, or several units daisy-chained together? If it's multiple units, then it's to do with your DMX dial-up. Each individual pack (usually 6 or 12 channels) has a starting DMXaddress which is set-able to whatever you choose - our houselightdimmer pack is set to 156 so that it's clear of our stage packs. If your dimmer rack is all one unit, then the houselights have been softpatched at the desk; what that means is that channel 167 on the desk is not necessarily controlling dimmer 167, it has been set to control another dimmer. Look for a menu on the desk called "PATCH". Often in theatres which are permanently hard-patched (like yours) I softpatch so that all my warm generals, cool generals, backlight colours etcetc are in order on the desk, rather than being distributed according to what dimmer I plugged them into.
Quote:
About adding a new fixture.
Our dimmers are pre-wired, just need to plug into the fly bars above the stage, and if all dimmers arent pre-wired I would have to..well, I would have to call the person who desighned the theatre about that, because the dimmer is against the wall with no access to the rear of the dimmers. And all wires pipped in through the top.
Anyways, Fixtures have not been plugged into different channels, or new fixtures added in..wlel, since the theatre was built I am assuming, will I need to be careful with the specific dimmer or anything? It not being using for so long? Or will it be fine?
Because we are planning on getting at least 10 new fixtures soon.
You should be fine. Just don't run the channel to full right away (which you shouldn't do anyway!) - run it at 30% for a while to let the lamp warm up.
Quote:
How to dimmers really work?
For some reason I am getting a picture like,
Going from the DMX outlit were I plug the board into, that outlet goes to dimmer 1, out of dimmer one to dimmer 2, and so on to 48, so they are all daisy chained, and a fixture is plugged into any dimmer. But what about a DMX light, like a moving head or a LEDeffect? What would I do with it? Because we are thinking of one or two DMX lights aswell, but I really dont know what to do with them. I would call in the desighner for somethign like this, but if you guys culd help me, I wouldnt need to bother him.
You're pretty much right on the dimmers - they take DMX from the desk, and then power from a power supply - the lamps get their powers from the dimmers. DMXfixtures (LEDs, scrollers, movers etc) don't get plugged into a dimmer; you daisy-chain the DMX out of the dimmers (have a look - there's probably a socket marked DMXTHRU or DMX OUT) into your fixture, which you set to a unique DMXaddress - a different address to the dimmeraddress - each DMXfixture needs its own address so it can be controlled individually. You then plug the fixture into HARD POWER - NOT a dimmer. DMX controls the dimming - plug a moving light into a dimmer and it will not be happy. What sort of DMX lights are you thinking of - I thought we'd got you to realise that moving heads are not what you need?
It is one unit, the Colortan i96. It came pre-assembled kind of thing when the theatre was built. I will will re-read the Patching section on the board's manual, It does get kind of confusing jumping to channel, 100 or so from 16.
Okay, will warm it up slowly. (Maybe even warming it up without the unit plugged in?)
Haha, I just had a little apifiny,
Am I right by saying, all the dimmers are daisychained via DMX, then out of the last dimmer, goes out a DMXwire going to any DMX controlable lighting fixture? And basicly the board sees every single dimmer as its own lighting unit, and not whats plugged into it? The dimmer and fixture as one thing? And we could have up to the units maximum on any specific board in DMX channels, in DMX, and only 96 non-DMX lights plugged int the dimmers.
Also, I just realised while typing why the fixtures are spaced out, because their DMX channels, and in my some what okay knowlege on how DMX works, each channel is spaced out 14 channels correct?
Yes, you did, But me and the person we call in for help and the few other students onboard with the theatre argued about like, 2 or 4 cheap ones, so we can have some kind of a spotlight, even if it can only be used at dark scenes, and during dance rehersals we thought it would be great to have a smoothly mocing spotlight. Because we have no actual followspots, we just fade between the 16 foh spots to create that kind of feeling. We also realize we need other lighing fixtures aswell, thats why the budgest for moving heads and priority is lowest.
What other DMX fixtures would oyu recomend us trying to get? Or what kind of fixture.
Also, I dont know if you saw the post were I said that I ran intot he school for something and just had a quick run into the stage to correct my fixture counts, but had no time to stay. I realized my coutns were way off and that we actually had,
FOH-
16 Colortran Spots
Above Stage-
3 Colortran Strip Lights/Color
11 Colortran Fresnels
5 Far Cycs (And someone asked if I was suing properly and if I had Cycs, are Cycs the, kind of "fringe curtain" that is positioned infront of the actual curtain? If so, use we have them infrotn of all three curtains.)
Thank you for clearifing that a dimmer has two channels, I never did understand why we had 48 dimmers but the rack is called the i96.
I do not know the kind of dimmer module we have, but all 48 are the same model. I suppose it would say on the back, or maybe the description of the i96 online. They came witht he rack.
gafftaper-
Yes, I would never think of cleaning the dimmers myself, I dont know if oyu said it because of my other post were I said I would be cleanign and fixing all the lights we have, but I didnt meen dimmers.
If I were to ever think of cleaning the dimmers I would shutdown the power going to them and were anti-static bracelits, I will add it to the list of thigns I want to talk about with the guy who comes in.
I was counting a dimmer as the actual unit I see in the rack itself. Thanks for clearing that up aswell.
JChenault, Thank you for saying that even thoughe ach dimemr module has two channels they are controlled like one unti, But other posts I was thinking each dimmer could control two channles individualy.
As far as number of dimmers, we have 96, or 48 controlable ones. We only have 35 fixtures, so theres a nice gap.
Yes, I know a little about the DMX channles that need to be set on DMX lights, 14 channels apart correct? Even if its only a 4 channel light. And channels are selected by dipswitches, or newer ones have interfaces on the unit.
Also another quick question.
We can control each row of houslights (11 rows in all if im not mistaken, including proscenium.) indivudaly, do you thinkg that they are connected to the dimmers, or using a DMX kind of chain? If a DMX chain I would asume I could contorl each houslight indivudaly, if I can, the channel numbers have never been recorded. I havnt been up in the rafters in a very long time.
I just realised somehting, again,
If our houslight rows are connected to the dimmer as their own "unit", that meens we have no open dimmers at all. I am thinking that is the case, if so, that leads to our theatre as being a pretty much hardwired theatre. And not desighned to ad on anything, pretty muchs et it and forget it. If thats the case we might need to think about getting another dimmer rack, or re-wiring the houslights for house facing and house away. (The wayour ceiling is setup, if your looking at it from the stage back, you can only see house away rows of houselights, if your in the back, you can only see house facing rows of hosuelights.)
Yes, you did, But me and the person we call in for help and the few other students onboard with the theatre argued about like, 2 or 4 cheap ones, so we can have some kind of a spotlight, even if it can only be used at dark scenes, and during dance rehersals we thought it would be great to have a smoothly mocing spotlight. Because we have no actual followspots, we just fade between the 16 foh spots to create that kind of feeling.
What other DMX fixtures would oyu recomend us trying to get? Or what kind of fixture.
Don't try using a moving light as a followspot. It won't work. Without one of the radio tracking systems that occasionally are talked about here, you can't effectively use a mover as a followspot because you can't get an actor or dancer to walk exactly the same path at exactly the same speed at exactly the same time every night. It just doesn't work that way. I've seen it done successfully a grand total of once, and that was because the actor's path was entirely determined by the set, and he was moving in time with the music which was pre-recorded and so he had no option as to where to walk, and the speed of his walk - and even then it took my operator (who is hugely experienced and superb) a huge amount of time in tweaking of cues to make it work. If you must get DMX toys - which I don't think you should - then look at gobo rotators, maybe some scrollers, possibly animation wheels (do you use them in the States?!) but nothing else. Something else that you may not have thought about is a hazer - it'll make your lighting look good in the air, just be triple-sure that it's OK with the school and that you're not going to trigger any fire alarms - because a haze machine will set fire alarms off if they're smoke detectors.
Yes, I know a little about the DMX channles that need to be set on DMX lights, 14 channels apart correct? Even if its only a 4 channel light. And channels are selected by dipswitches, or newer ones have interfaces on the unit.
Where'd you get that from? You put them as many channels apart as they need to be - if it's a four-channel unit and your dialup starts at 200, then the next one is 204, the next 208, the next 212 and so on and so on. You don't have to do this - I tend to dial units up at intervals of 20, unless I'm using units with more than 20 channels, just because it's tidy and easy to remember. So long as the channels don't overlap you can dial them up with whatever intervals you please.
We can control each row of houslights (11 rows in all if im not mistaken, including proscenium.) indivudaly, do you thinkg that they are connected to the dimmers, or using a DMX kind of chain? If a DMX chain I would asume I could contorl each houslight indivudaly, if I can, the channel numbers have never been recorded. I havnt been up in the rafters in a very long time.
As has been pointed out, you need to get a good book on lighting... or better, find someone to spend a couple of hours with you in the theater going over how things work.
I'll try and correct some apparant misconceptions that you have, so bear with me for a bit. Note in the following I'm talking about DMX channels, not control board channels.
First, "DMX". At it's basic level, DMX is a signal sent down a pair of wires. That signal contains a nimber (between 0 and 255) for each of 512 "channels". When DMX is sent to dimmers, each dimmer will pick the value of its single assigned channel, and set it's output accordingly. Generally (though not always) a rack of dimmers will use a sequential block of channels.
For example, a rack of 96 dimmers will use DMX channels 1 through 96, or perhaps even 123 through 218. Or there may (in some racks) an arbitrary assignment of DMX channels to Dimmers.
For other DMX-controlled devices, the device will generally be set to the starting DMXchannel. If it's a one channel device (like a scroller,) it will only take one channel. If it's something more complicated, it will take more channels in sequence. For example, a VL2500 Spot will take 22 channels. So if you were using a Vl2500, and it's starting address was 30, the next fixture/dimmer/whatever would have to be at a starting address of 52 or higher.
Am I right by saying, all the dimmers are daisychained via DMX, then out of the last dimmer, goes out a DMXwire going to any DMX controlable lighting fixture?
With a dimmer rack, the DMX is not "daisy-chained" to all the dimmers. The DMX goes to a contoller, then dhen drives all the dimmers. Sometimes, the controller also has a DMX output, that can then be daisy-chained to other fixtures. However, the i96 doesn't have any DMX outputs, and the DMX input is not accessable in the rack. I believe your board has only one DMX output, so that needs to connect to the dimmers. In order to drive any other DMX devices off your current board, you would need to add a DMX splitter to the output of the board. One output would then drive the dimmers, and the other would drive the DMX devices. Note that you still only have 512 channels, so the channels used by the dimmers couldn't be used by other devices. Also, since you only have a 48 channel board, you may not be able to add any devices, anyway.
If you do get a new board, get one with 2 DMX outputs, or include a splitter, if you want to be able to use other devices. (I'd start with scrollers, personally.)
And basicly the board sees every single dimmer as its own lighting unit, and not whats plugged into it? The dimmer and fixture as one thing? And we could have up to the units maximum on any specific board in DMX channels, in DMX, and only 96 non-DMX lights plugged int the dimmers.
Not quite. Your board just sees channels. It doesn't care what's on the channel. (Newer boards do, but that's another discussion.) How many lights are plugged into each dimmer is limited only by the dimmer capacity.
Here's an example. With soft-patching on the board, you could have one slider controlling 3 DMX channels. These 3 channels would control 3 dimmers. Each dimmer could have 4 instruments plugged into them. So, moving the one slider could control 12 lights in unison.
Also, I just realised while typing why the fixtures are spaced out, because their DMX channels, and in my some what okay knowlege on how DMX works, each channel is spaced out 14 channels correct?
Nope. any channelspacing is purely arbitrary when dealing with dimmers. I really think that your dimmers should just be channels 1-96, but I guess the installer didn't see it that way.
But me and the person we call in for help and the few other students onboard with the theatre argued about like, 2 or 4 cheap ones, so we can have some kind of a spotlight
At this point, none. You can't control anything else. If you do get a new board, I'd start with scrollers... nothing more complicated, and certanly nothing that moves.
are Cycs the, kind of "fringe curtain" that is positioned infront of the actual curtain?
JChenault, Thank you for saying that even thoughe ach dimemr module has two channels they are controlled like one unti, But other posts I was thinking each dimmer could control two channles individualy.
As far as number of dimmers, we have 96, or 48 controlable ones. We only have 35 fixtures, so theres a nice gap.
You have 96 controllable dimmers. Even though there are 2 dimmers per module, each dimmer is individually controllable.
We can control each row of houslights (11 rows in all if im not mistaken, including proscenium.) indivudaly, do you thinkg that they are connected to the dimmers, or using a DMX kind of chain? If a DMX chain I would asume I could contorl each houslight indivudaly, if I can, the channel numbers have never been recorded. I havnt been up in the rafters in a very long time.
Don't try using a moving light as a followspot. It won't work. Without one of the radio tracking systems that occasionally are talked about here, you can't effectively use a mover as a followspot because you can't get an actor or dancer to walk exactly the same path at exactly the same speed at exactly the same time every night. It just doesn't work that way. I've seen it done successfully a grand total of once, and that was because the actor's path was entirely determined by the set, and he was moving in time with the music which was pre-recorded and so he had no option as to where to walk, and the speed of his walk - and even then it took my operator (who is hugely experienced and superb) a huge amount of time in tweaking of cues to make it work. If you must get DMX toys - which I don't think you should - then look at gobo rotators, maybe some scrollers, possibly animation wheels (do you use them in the States?!) but nothing else. Something else that you may not have thought about is a hazer - it'll make your lighting look good in the air, just be triple-sure that it's OK with the school and that you're not going to trigger any fire alarms - because a haze machine will set fire alarms off if they're smoke detectors.
Where'd you get that from? You put them as many channels apart as they need to be - if it's a four-channel unit and your dialup starts at 200, then the next one is 204, the next 208, the next 212 and so on and so on. You don't have to do this - I tend to dial units up at intervals of 20, unless I'm using units with more than 20 channels, just because it's tidy and easy to remember. So long as the channels don't overlap you can dial them up with whatever intervals you please.
I'd be very surprised if each of your houselights was a DMX-controllable fixture. They'll be patched into your dimmers one row per dimmer.
Well, we were aware that it would be sort of hard to use them as a follow spot.
But we where thinking we would rent a cheap one and see how hard it would be to move it manually with encoder wheels or like the Expression 3 we had, had 5 wheels on the side for moving lights. If not, we were thinking of getting a tiny light board with a joystick to control them. But we are still thinking about all this.
Will look at the kind of fixtures you said. And we really could use a hazer/fogger. Would be great for dance recitals, and other scenes in plays. Yeah, would have to talk with maintenance to see how sensitive the smoke detectors are. But doesnt a Haze machine fog stay on the ground like dry ice? And fog machiens go everywere? So I haze machine should be fine.
Im not sure, for some reason I just thought DMX channels had to be seperated in intervals of 14
Yeah, me too. So I am thinking we need to be doing some re-wiring :/
As has been pointed out, you need to get a good book on lighting... or better, find someone to spend a couple of hours with you in the theater going over how things work.
I'll try and correct some apparant misconceptions that you have, so bear with me for a bit. Note in the following I'm talking about DMX channels, not control board channels.
First, "DMX". At it's basic level, DMX is a signal sent down a pair of wires. That signal contains a nimber (between 0 and 255) for each of 512 "channels". When DMX is sent to dimmers, each dimmer will pick the value of its single assigned channel, and set it's output accordingly. Generally (though not always) a rack of dimmers will use a sequential block of channels.
For example, a rack of 96 dimmers will use DMX channels 1 through 96, or perhaps even 123 through 218. Or there may (in some racks) an arbitrary assignment of DMX channels to Dimmers.
For other DMX-controlled devices, the device will generally be set to the starting DMXchannel. If it's a one channel device (like a scroller,) it will only take one channel. If it's something more complicated, it will take more channels in sequence. For example, a VL2500 Spot will take 22 channels. So if you were using a Vl2500, and it's starting address was 30, the next fixture/dimmer/whatever would have to be at a starting address of 52 or higher.
In general, sort of. in your case, no.
With a dimmer rack, the DMX is not "daisy-chained" to all the dimmers. The DMX goes to a contoller, then dhen drives all the dimmers. Sometimes, the controller also has a DMX output, that can then be daisy-chained to other fixtures. However, the i96 doesn't have any DMX outputs, and the DMX input is not accessable in the rack. I believe your board has only one DMX output, so that needs to connect to the dimmers. In order to drive any other DMX devices off your current board, you would need to add a DMX splitter to the output of the board. One output would then drive the dimmers, and the other would drive the DMX devices. Note that you still only have 512 channels, so the channels used by the dimmers couldn't be used by other devices. Also, since you only have a 48 channel board, you may not be able to add any devices, anyway.
If you do get a new board, get one with 2 DMX outputs, or include a splitter, if you want to be able to use other devices. (I'd start with scrollers, personally.)
Not quite. Your board just sees channels. It doesn't care what's on the channel. (Newer boards do, but that's another discussion.) How many lights are plugged into each dimmer is limited only by the dimmer capacity.
Here's an example. With soft-patching on the board, you could have one slider controlling 3 DMX channels. These 3 channels would control 3 dimmers. Each dimmer could have 4 instruments plugged into them. So, moving the one slider could control 12 lights in unison.
Nope. any channelspacing is purely arbitrary when dealing with dimmers. I really think that your dimmers should just be channels 1-96, but I guess the installer didn't see it that way.
At this point, none. You can't control anything else. If you do get a new board, I'd start with scrollers... nothing more complicated, and certanly nothing that moves.
No. A cyc is a (usually light-colored) backdrop, that is lit to brovide a background color.
You have 96 Dimmers. They are just in 48 modules.
You have 96 controllable dimmers. Even though there are 2 dimmers per module, each dimmer is individually controllable.
It's likely your houselights are using some of your dimmers. Best to get someone who knows what they are doing to look at it.
Thanks for explaining everything. So we can control 96 fixtures individually correct? With 48 dimmers. Good to know ^^'
As for a controller in the rack. There is a device on the very bottom of the rack that looks like it didn't come with the rack itself. I have never worried about it. Must be it : )
Heh, I never did realize why boards had two DMX outputs. I thought it was override other baords, like we did when we had rented the Expression 3 last year, we overrided our Status. I am pretty sure the Element has two DMX outs? The Status might too, Havnt seen it in, a summer. I will take a closer look at the unit at the bottom of our rack to see if it is indeed a controlelr and if it has a DMX out. Betteroff, I will just look in the theatre's scimatics (sp?).
Like I have said, a guy from Leviton, one who was on the team as a rooky when our theatre is built and is now a higher rank, who worked on the project is comming in and I am building a list by being on this forum what to go over in person with him.
As for Cycs, Now a I know what you meen, didnt know what those were called. I might have the wrong name, but our Far Cycs are definetly for lighting up the stage in general. And they do a pretty good job.
Haha, I just had a little apifiny,
Am I right by saying, all the dimmers are daisy-chained via DMX, then out of the last dimmer, goes out a DMXwire going to any DMX controllable lighting fixture? And basically the board sees every single dimmer as its own lighting unit, and not whats plugged into it? The dimmer and fixture as one thing? And we could have up to the units maximum on any specific board in DMX channels, in DMX, and only 96 non-DMX lights plugged int the dimmers.
Typically there is a single dmx cable feeding a device. In your case a device is the entire rack of dimmers. There is an internal circuit board that takes the DMX message and sends individual level information to each dimmer. There is no internal cable going from dimmer to dimmer. You are correct that the board does not understand what is plugged into a dimmer - it just spits out the DMX values. (Now if you get into moving light consoles, this gets more complex - but that is not what you have).
If you have a moving light, or some other fancy fixture that is controlled by DMX, this is considered another DMX device. Since this fixture is a DMX device, you can daisy chain the cable from device to device up to 32 devices. If your dimmer rack supports DMX Out - you can run a DMX cable from the dimmer rack to the fixture(s). Note that you also have to supply 120 volt power to the device.
Some consoles have multiple DMX out ports. Yours does not. There are companies that make splitters for the signal. IE you could run a cable from your console to the splitter, and from the splitter you would have two cables - one to the dimmer rack, and one to the moving lights.
Also, I just realised while typing why the fixtures are spaced out, because their DMX channels, and in my some what okay knowlege on how DMX works, each channel is spaced out 14 channels correct?
Ok - I'm going to be pedantic here because it is important. I'm trying to assist but I can't understand what you are asking. Please try to use the correct terms. Please spell check. Please prof read for clarity. Make it easy for me to help you instead of hard.
Fixtures don't have DMX addresses unless they are intelligent lights and have a dmx cable connected to them. Are we talking about fixtures which are DMX devices and have a dmx cable attached to them?
Dimmers do have dmx addresses - are you asking why the dimmers DMX addressing is set up the way it is?
Channels map to dmx addresses in the console. This is controlled by the patch in the console. Are you asking why the console was patched the way it is?
Thank you for clearifing that a dimmer has two channels, I never did understand why we had 48 dimmers but the rack is called the i96.
A dimmer does not have two channels. A dimmer does not 'have' channels at all. (I'm being pedantic again ). I can't find a spec sheet for your dimmer rack, [Edit by DL: Link to i96 cut sheet.pdf] but typically you will find in the rack a number of dimmer modules that can plug in and out of the rack. Each module can have one to several dimmers. You need to find out how many dimmers you have in the rack ( not how many modules) and what the capacity of each dimmer is. Note that you may have different types of modules in the dimmer rack.
As to the channel question - each dimmer in the rack has a single DMXaddress. The control console will map its channels to whatever DMXaddress you want. But you cannot assign a single DMXaddress (dimmeraddress) to more than one channel. You can assign a single channel to multiple DMX addresses, but not the other way around.
As far as number of dimmers, we have 96, or 48 controlable ones. We only have 35 fixtures, so theres a nice gap.
Curious - why are only 48 controllable? Are they controlled by a houselightsystem or something? What are they for?
I just realised somehting, again,
If our houslight rows are connected to the dimmer as their own "unit", that meens we have no open dimmers at all. I am thinking that is the case, if so, that leads to our theatre as being a pretty much hardwired theatre. And not desighned to ad on anything, pretty muchs et it and forget it. If thats the case we might need to think about getting another dimmer rack, or re-wiring the houslights for house facing and house away. (The wayour ceiling is setup, if your looking at it from the stage back, you can only see house away rows of houselights, if your in the back, you can only see house facing rows of hosuelights.)
In your situation, unless you are going to get an electrician, it really does not matter how many dimmers you have in the rack, it only matters how many dimmers you have circuits for. A suggestion. Go into your theatre. Look at every place you have a fixture plugged into a circuit. Look for all of the circuit boxes you can find. There should be some kind of label on the circuit - typically a number. Make a chart showing where each circuit is, and what it's number is. Count how many different circuits you have found. That is the number of dimmers you have available. Save this chart for future reference.
