Horizon Submaster Control Wing
- Thread startermichael728
- Start date
Dionysus
Well-Known Member
I have two at work and one here at home in my office closet 
Have you tried calling Horizon Tech Support? They are technically discontinues, but the last 3 people I sent that way were able to get what they needed (upgraded licenses and a parallel interface). It is worth a shot.
~Dave
Have you tried calling Horizon Tech Support? They are technically discontinues, but the last 3 people I sent that way were able to get what they needed (upgraded licenses and a parallel interface). It is worth a shot.~Dave
DuckJordan
Touring IATSE Member
Malabaristo
Well-Known Member
I'd definitely vote for following the previous suggestions as your first choice, but if you get completely stuck let me know. Once upon a time I made a custom facepanel (keypad and I think 12 faders or so) that made use of their serial command structure. It was a bit of a kluge and I only used it a couple of times, but I could probably dig up some notes and provide some direction if you want to pursue building your own.
This would require that you have some knowledge of electronics and a lot of free time, so it's not exactly an ideal solution.
This would require that you have some knowledge of electronics and a lot of free time, so it's not exactly an ideal solution.
DuckJordan
Touring IATSE Member
on the horizon wings all they had on them were 20 faders and bump buttons for each, very basic devices, which i believe connected to the horizon box so, unless you know the devices coding it would be nearly impossible to make your own. i'll look after break but i am pretty sure you have to go through the horizon box first so you'd have to have the right codes being sent to the horizon box.
The software itself was always free, but you could not have a usable system with out an active software key via USB dongle, or activation code. This was actually one of their selling points since smaller theatres could purchase a license for only the number of control channels they needed, as opposed to paying for a whole universe (or two) at the per channel pricing.
DuckJordan, the wing has 24 faders and bump buttons, not 20. It connects via a parallel to serial cable directly to the computer. Not all systems require a "Horizon Box" as you call it. Mine, for example, uses a PathPort Node to do the conversion.
~Dave
DuckJordan
Touring IATSE Member
you may have a newer version than me. or i may be wrong i haven't looked at it for 3 shows... they've had me running sound.... either way to get it to communicate correctly with horizon is going to take a bit of programing...
we actually paid for a universe, although wasn't it a setting in the horizon box? because no where on the software could i find where it stated how many channels we could control...
in addition, we have re-installed the software and have never been asked for a key, it also lets us use the full software... what i don't understand about your post is that you say you can pay per channel but i have never found a case where they bought it that way. in a version off our software disc it only blocked off the "gold" features which were just some dj effect and automation wizards so i am confused on your saying without the key you didn't have a working station.
we actually paid for a universe, although wasn't it a setting in the horizon box? because no where on the software could i find where it stated how many channels we could control...
in addition, we have re-installed the software and have never been asked for a key, it also lets us use the full software... what i don't understand about your post is that you say you can pay per channel but i have never found a case where they bought it that way. in a version off our software disc it only blocked off the "gold" features which were just some dj effect and automation wizards so i am confused on your saying without the key you didn't have a working station.
Last edited:
By "Horizon Box" you must have been referring to their parallel interface. I was curious about your phrasing there. In your case, that does hold the license and was designed as an off the shelf solution for a small single universe system. Not all systems have that. Many of them just have some sort of PC with a dongle. Our whole system runs on a network with PathPort Nodes doing all of the converting of the control signal via CAT 6 cable to DMX 512, so I can plug a computer in at any point in the network and run Horizon from there. Sounds like you have a more traditional DMX backbone system where the control signal is converted immediately to DMX512 via the parallel interface, then run through your facility.
I have had both of my wings for over 6 years, not aware of any other versions of the unit. However, it has been around since the late 90's, so that certainly could be possible. I do agree with you though, it would take a bit of programming to get something custom made to work correctly.
~Dave
I have had both of my wings for over 6 years, not aware of any other versions of the unit. However, it has been around since the late 90's, so that certainly could be possible. I do agree with you though, it would take a bit of programming to get something custom made to work correctly.
~Dave
DuckJordan
Touring IATSE Member
not only that i'm betting the legal repercussions of such programming would make many cringe. it seems i need to get more up to date with a system rarely used in the area. Yes i am referring to basically the off the shelf system of there parallel device connecting to those massive "printer" ports of the 90's but i did happen to run in just a bit ago and found i was wrong it does go into the computer to the program then from the program out the lpt1 port and then to our DMX line which then to our dimmers... so i was mistaken.
not to take this off topic but doesn't their marquee series use horizon, but they just put it on a console instead of allowing you to install on a computer.
not to take this off topic but doesn't their marquee series use horizon, but they just put it on a console instead of allowing you to install on a computer.
You are correct, Marquee does run Horizon in the background. Essentially it was a big interface face for Horizon for those that could not wrap their head around a PC solution for lighting and just HAD to have a board. And, the basic structure of the new Palette series uses a lot of the Marquee (and thus Horizon) programming from my understanding, with obvious updating.
~Dave
~Dave
Malabaristo
Well-Known Member
Apparently I was capable of doing the nearly impossible back in college. At the time I was interfacing to a Horizon Playback Controller. I don't know if it was limited to that hardware or not, but there was a published set of RS-232 commands available to control it. I made a custom piece of hardware with some faders and a keypad that sent those serial commands to Horizon. I was basically aiming to make a proper facepanel rather than just a submaster wing, and I mostly succeeded. It was just very prototype, and I never followed through with a more polished version.
Picture a piece of plastic with some buttons and faders on it, and a whole lot of wire going into a breadboard with some chips on it. The breadboard then connected to the parallel port of an old laptop which was running a program written in QBASIC that translated the button hits and fader movements into serial commands. It was not the prettiest thing I've ever made.
Since this seems to have gotten a bit of attention, I had to go pull out the folder with my notes in it. It looks like the serial protocol is exactly the same as their macro command structure, so the programming involved is actually pretty straightforward. I'm still not sure whether it would work on any system or only on their LPC hardware.
If I remember right the Horizon wings cost about $1000. Is there any particular reason you are trying to spend that kind of money on accessories for dead software? For about $1500 you can get Champsys' MagicQ software, a MagicQ Mini-wing, and a DMX/USB dongle. Or for about $1600 you could even get something like an ETC Smartfade.
michael728
Member
I'd love to see the schematics for any custom made slider. I'm still looking for any SubMaster Wings that anyone would like to sell as well!
I saw someone had mentioned this but yes the software is free to try but wont output to DMX without a license, and the submaster wing has 24 sliders 4 banks of 6..
I saw someone had mentioned this but yes the software is free to try but wont output to DMX without a license, and the submaster wing has 24 sliders 4 banks of 6..
michael728
Member
DuckJordan
Touring IATSE Member
my suggestion would be to keep your eye out on ebay, since it is getting harder and harder to find fader wings for the origional horizon system... is there a reason you want physical faders? we use horizon completely without any faders and it works perfectly for our shows, of course we program and run em and we don't do to many non scripted events that would require more than lights on and off kind of thing.
I'd be interested to hear what capabilities Horizon has that Marquee or Palette-series don't?
Michael I wish I had one for you.
http://www.horizoncontrol.com/html/wing_panel.html
Last edited:
The dongle is a software key for systems that use a node. Giving one the right to operate the software without a parallel interface
the parallel interface is also a hardware device and software key to operate various numbers of of control channels up to 512.
Horizon was developed way back when a dimmer/lamp was the primary device to be controlled. for a price "gold" level moving fixture control could be added.
The developing needs of moving fixture control soon out paced horizon capability's. The horizon controls development team built Marquee software from the bottom up with motion control first and foremost in their mind.
Horizon and Marquee look very similar on the screen but they are very different.
Soon after the Marquee line was introduced the horizon product line was discontinued. Many corporate changes have resulted in "horizon control" becoming closely associated with strand lighting. The end result being that Marquee products have no active marketing done.
even if they are fine products. they end up taking a back seat to strand lighting products.
Similar threads
