Conventional Fixtures DLED Elation RGB 108 PARS: ghost in the machine

[xander]

The control map goes

EOS
ethernet
ethernet switch
ethernet
NET3 Gateway(4 port) Universe 4
5 pin DMX
Opto Isolator
5 pin DMX
fixture

What board are you using?

She is using the same desk the designer used the previous time. This is the point the designer was making. It is possible that the designer was unaware of the problems because his/her electrician fixed it prior to their arrival. It is also possible the board was already set to a slower DMX rate. It is such an easy fix there is no reason not to give it a try. Oh, and never listen to the designer when it comes to troubleshooting a rig

 

[Margaret]

Update: We are changing the profile on the DLED PARs

I am having the designer contact the previous electrician to see if they have any insight.

Again, thanks for sticking with me guys!

margaret

 

[DavidNorth]

Margaret,

Some questions:

- Are you running the Gateways in Net2 or Net3 mode?
- Which output ports are you using on the GWs? You mention Universes 4 and 6 but which GW port are the Universes patched to?

I suggest you run the GWs in Net3 mode and set the port output speed to Slow. If that fixes it, you're done. If not, please let me know the answers to the above.

Do you need to know how to configure the GWs?

David

 

[Margaret]

We are using the NET3 gateways on their default setting. They were a direct ship/new purchase from ETC to the theatre.

If I remember correctly they are in ACM/NET3 mode. I have Universe 4 in the first two ports of the GW and Universe 6 in the second two ports of the gateway.

I will configure them to slow at dinner and let you know if that helps.

I think they both have opto splitters on them but I'll have to check on dinner

Thanks so much David

-margaret-

 

[Margaret]

Update: We slowed the DMX rate and it actually made the problem worse.

Great idea!

sadly not our problem I guess.
m

 

[starksk]

Hi Margaret,

Did you see any difference between the fixtures on Universe 4 and the fixtures on Universe 6? (Those connected to the first two ports versus the last 2 ports)

Can you tell us the software versions of both the Gateway and the Eos console?
--You can see the software version in GCE in the properties of the gateway
--You can see the current Eos software version by clearing your command line and pressing [About]

[Edit:] Can you also try setting the speed to medium to see if that has any effect?

Is RDM enabled on your gateways?

 

[Margaret]

there is no difference between the universes in terms of reaction.

we've tried, fast, slow and medium neither of which have made a difference.

version on EOS: 1.9.6.9.0.3

version on the gateways:

NET3 U/3-6: 3.1.0.9.0.4
NET3 U/1 + 2: 2.0.2.0.9.0.1.4

RDM: disabled

thanks kirk.
m

 

[starksk]

I do find it interesting that your universe 1 and 2 gateways are running an older version of code, however that shouldn't make a large difference.

Can you verify on the Eos console, that in the shell under Settings>Network>Protocols "Use Draft sACN (0.2)" is checked? (It should be based on the code versions you are using in the gateways.)

Have you tried swapping gateways to see if the problem follows that particular 4-port gateway? (Now that we know some gateways are running older code, I would be curious to see if swapping in an older code gateway causes the same result)

Which mode are you running the fixtures in currently? Which mode were you running when the problem was first noticed?

Are there any other control sources other than the Eos on the network? (Other consoles, Clients, Computers, etc...)

Another troubleshooting tool that is useful in ruling in/out sACN issues is sACNView. This free program will allow you to see the data on the network and verify that the control is really coming from where you think it should be coming from. In this case, it would be useful to verify that when the fixtures get stuck in white, there is no data on the net telling them to do so.

 

[eloader]

Please be advised these fixtures might need a software update for a known issue we have. Please make sure the “supplier or dealer” whoever it is gets an E-Loader updater and updates all units to the current version.

Contact Elation service for more information and support directly - [email protected]

Eric Loader
Director of Sales
Elation Professional

 

[Margaret]

I do find it interesting that your universe 1 and 2 gateways are running an older version of code, however that shouldn't make a large difference.

The NET3 box running U/1 and U/2 is from the rental house and was not a new box from ETC.

Can you verify on the Eos console, that in the shell under Settings>Network>Protocols "Use Draft sACN (0.2)" is checked? (It should be based on the code versions you are using in the gateways.)

I will let you know when I have access to the board.

Have you tried swapping gateways to see if the problem follows that particular 4-port gateway? (Now that we know some gateways are running older code, I would be curious to see if swapping in an older code gateway causes the same result)

I will do that first thing tomorrow.

Which mode are you running the fixtures in currently? Which mode were you running when the problem was first noticed?

We are running them in 5 channel mode. We created the profile for the fixture and are working on a different profile for 4 channel mode to see if that fixes the problem.

Are there any other control sources other than the Eos on the network? (Other consoles, Clients, Computers, etc...)

We have another EOS on the system serving as the RPU. We also are linked into video via a midi gateway.

Another troubleshooting tool that is useful in ruling in/out sACN issues issACNView. This free program will allow you to see the data on the network and verify that the control is really coming from where you think it should be coming from. In this case, it would be useful to verify that when the fixtures get stuck in white, there is no data on the net telling them to do so.

I will check it out and run it on the system as soon as tech is over.

awesome.
margaret

 

[eloader]

First of all, Elation most certainly is not a high end company. They are in fact a DJ company. I will admit they are better than they used to be, but I would categorize them as lower mid range quality wise. With that many units, I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if you have some sort of product defect in one or a few.

Besides that, though, I still think that it is a signal issue. While the DMX standard states the maximum device count is 32, what is considered one "device" isn't exactly intuitive. Since your counts are getting close to the maximum, my first step would be to add another line. Most likely these fixtures do not have highly sensitive receivers and if you don't have a signal booster inline, the data is probably not getting across unadulterated. I would add another opto and split the two particularly large runs into two separate runs each. And TERMINATE EVERY RUN!

-Tim

Hi Tim,

Please help me understand what is a "high end company". While the roots of Elation do come from the DJ market - which was and is very good to us by the way - we are focused as a company for the past 6 years on the "professional" entertainment lighing market and working hard every day to meet the demands and expectations of this market.

While I personally have over 16 years in the "professsional" Lighting market and within our company many of our staff also has roots fromt the pro side...we know we still have work to do to change this perception by a few in the market of Elation's capabilities as a company today and in the future, while still keeping our mission of providing high quality, high value products for the entertainment lighting & video market offering the best performace to value ratio in the industry.

From my experience, I know this takes time to change perceptions and I invite you to try our products and give us feedback any time so we can improve and meet your and others expectations as we are in this for the long haul!

Sincerely,

Eric Loader
Director of Sales
Elation Professional

 

[bishopthomas]

Hey, Eric, and welcome to Control Booth. Thanks for your response, I think it's spot on and well said.

 

[Margaret]

I want to thank everyone for their responses.

We finally solved this beast of a problem today. We switched the DLED PARs to 4 channel mode instead of 5 so that the board could control the intensity.

I think that made a difference but what really solved the issue was changing the way the fixtures are pixel mapped. The way the pixel mapping was done was capturing the white channel on the fade out and making the effects twitchy.

so solved!

thanks again, especially to the genlemen from ETC all of your ideas were thoughtful and awesome.

- margaret -

PS: Eric, I appreciate your comments as well. I would make an argument that if Elation wanted to step into the fray as a high end company; your post would have offered suggestions on how to fix the problem on top of your eloquent defense of Elation equipment.

 

[ELASERV]

HI there a friend informed me of your post. i to am new to this forum as well. if you can please email me and i or one of my guys will be more than happy to assist you. I am the service manager for elation lighting. please email service at elation lighting dot com.

Best regards,
Gines Gines

 

[ELASERV]

Ooops i just noticed it was resolved. Anyhow if ever anyone has any elation questions please feel free to contact me.

Best Regards,
Gines Gines
elation service manager.

 

[techno89]

Ooops i just noticed it was resolved. Anyhow if ever anyone has any elation questions please feel free to contact me.

Best Regards,
Gines Gines
elation service manager.

I love your name

 

[eloader]

Hi Margaret,

Great to hear the issue was solved via the control system. There are many variables on how our fixtures can be controlled so it was tough for me - as a sales guy - to give you a solution at the time other than my previous post which was do do a firmware update but certainly we were and are ready to help in any way we can and I have informed our service manager of this forum and since we are new to this forum but will keep an eye on it now to see if we can pitch in solutions to issues with our products in the future. So that is great to be on here now.

On another note, your project sounds very interesting so if you would be interested in doing some PR on it please let me know and email me directly.

Best Regards,

Eric Loader
Director of Sales
eric (at) elationlighting (dot) com

 

[FlashBang]

I have informed our service manager of this forum and since we are new to this forum but will keep an eye on it now to see if we can pitch in solutions to issues with our products in the future.

Eric Loader
Director of Sales
eric (at) elationlighting (dot) com

You guys hadn't heard about CB?

Well that right there proves you've yet to achieve "high-end" status, geez


(just a joke - no offense intended)

 

[eloader]

You guys hadn't heard about CB?

Well that right there proves you've yet to achieve "high-end" status, geez


(just a joke - no offense intended)

HA...love the French Canadian Humor! I can tell you we are glad to be a part of this forum now!

 

[derekleffew]

...On another note, your project sounds very interesting so if you would be interested in doing some PR on it please let me know and email me directly. ...

I just figured out what show this is, and in one of my old stomping grounds (a mere twenty-one years ago). Yes, Margaret, provided you're not under an NDA, please share all the gory details. "Bound for Broadway"? Maybe, maybe not.