Art-Net to ETCNET2

[theatre4jc]

I've been doing a lot of research and I'm sure I've been missing something simpley, yet key, to doing this. As of now this is just theory but I'm trying to get the money approved to upgrade my facility's console and want to have all the needs figured out before I do. Currently we are running an ETC Emphasis server to our Net2 sensor racks. We have almost 2 full universes of conventional dimming, plus another 1/4 universe of automated fixtures.

I want to upgrade to the Jands Vista T2. I can control 4 universes just fine, coming out of the console and into the node. But what about the other universes? I cannot find any converters that will go from a protocol that Jands speaks to ETCNet2 over Ethernet. So my options only look like I can use the 4 physical ports, which work just fine for universes 1-4 and then I could use an Art-Net to DMX converter with DMX going from the converter to the second NET2 node and attaching to one of my extra Net2 ethernet ports. But I hate going through an extra converter. Would this cause latency issues? Is this the best option out there or are there Art-Net to Net2 converters that I just haven't seen?

 

[derekleffew]

I don't believe ETC will allow anyone else's products to speak Net2. They are not alone in this.

Does it seem like we are moving backwards toward the pre-DMX512/1986 days when all gear HAD to come from only one manufacturer, OR, various and sundry converters had to be used?

 

[sarahsliefie]

Net3 should work fine. the Jands Vista T2 can send ACN over an Ethernet cable that will work with the Net2 of the ETC rack. I was told that Vista had hardware for that. The Ethernet can be split with a switch and run to the dimmer rack and one to each channel that then is converted to DMX where you need it. give your rep a call and they could easily speck out what you need.

I was just in a class today at ETC CUE that went over this subject.

 

[SteveB]

I'm assuming the racks are Sensor with CEM+ and get Net direct from a E-Net switch ?, and that there are Net 2 devices out in the system that gets DMX to the automated ?. Thus there's an investment in Net2 devices ?.

I know it's more elegant to go e-net out of the Vista to the "lighting system", but since the Vista's only putting out 4 universes anyway, and given that you need DMX out of nodes for automated you need nodes and have them already in the existing Net 2 devices.

At that point I'd skip the ArtNet to Net 2 route and simply get a Net3 4 port node, running in Net2 and take the 4 DMX outputs of the console as DMX into the Net 2 environment. Or, if you can find one, a used Net2 4 port node (rack or portable). Probably the cheapest solution.

 

[Footer]

I'm assuming the racks are Sensor with CEM+ and get Net direct from a E-Net switch ?, and that there are Net 2 devices out in the system that gets DMX to the automated ?. Thus there's an investment in Net2 devices ?.

I know it's more elegant to go e-net out of the Vista to the "lighting system", but since the Vista's only putting out 4 universes anyway, and given that you need DMX out of nodes for automated you need nodes and have them already in the existing Net 2 devices.

At that point I'd skip the ArtNet to Net 2 route and simply get a Net3 4 port node, running in Net2 and take the 4 DMX outputs of the console as DMX into the Net 2 environment. Or, if you can find one, a used Net2 4 port node (rack or portable). Probably the cheapest solution.

Yup, thats about it. At this point you are going to be limping along with the net2 stuff. I am not crazy about that system, especially with Emphasis in the mix. Do you have the option of running the dimmers off DMX? Might be worth while to throw a few artnet nodes into the mix and just run art-net everywhere. In reality, art-net is the most widely used lighting protocol. All of the newer ETC consoles use it, HogIII, GrandMA, and Chamsys all speak Art-Net. Sadly though, all of these same companies also have their own protocol. ETC folks, what is the true difference between Net3 and ACN or the two exactly the same thing?

 

[HansH]

SteveB's suggestion seems to make the most sense, particularly if you have the Net2 gear available. In considering a new Net3 gateway, keep in mind that the Net2 mode may not be supported. This was due to a recent hardware change in the gateway, and those are marked "Net3 Only". Older Net3 gateways or used Net2 hardware would be your best bet.

EDIT: Looks like I completely missed Footer's post -- a art-net system would also make a lot of sense, with DMX runs to the dimmer racks, or one Net2 node pulling DMX from the Vista and getting it over to the dimmer racks. Just depends on the gear you already have on-hand. Also, on the lines of that post -- Net3 and ACN aren't quite the same thing. At its core, Net3 is a proprietary protocol that is built on top of the ACN standard.

 

[Rob]

Currently there is no magic Ethernet-protocol to Ethernet-protocol converter box. So you're not missing something.

If your Net2 node can't be upgraded to Net3 (to receive the Jands sACN output), then your options are complicated. The most elegant solution is DMX from the Jands to a Net2 input. Otherwise, Art-Net to a node that understands Art-Net, have it output DMX to a Net2 node, which will do the conversion to Net2.

Where I more commonly see this situation is with Shownet systems and ETC EOS consoles. The console output must be converted to DMX so it can be converted back into Shownet. And the necessary node has usually not been budgeted for...

Robert.

Robert Armstrong
Technical Sales
Pathway Connectivity

 

[PadawanGeek]

Right now on our t2 I run one art net line from the console at foh to a rack onstage that has two 2-port art net nodes. two of the ports go to the movers, two of them go to dimmers.

Recently we did a gig at a college running etc net, and we ended up running two physical universes (we used an s3, but as mentioned, it can be coming from a node.). Into a reversed node in input mode.

Your best bet would be to have a rack with two of these (or an art net node of your choice) running into one of these.

 

[Footer]

Currently there is no magic Ethernet-protocol to Ethernet-protocol converter box. So you're not missing something.

If your Net2 node can't be upgraded to Net3 (to receive the Jands sACN output), then your options are complicated. The most elegant solution is DMX from the Jands to a Net2 input. Otherwise, Art-Net to a node that understands Art-Net, have it output DMX to a Net2 node, which will do the conversion to Net2.

Where I more commonly see this situation is with Shownet systems and ETC EOS consoles. The console output must be converted to DMX so it can be converted back into Shownet. And the necessary node has usually not been budgeted for...

Robert.

Robert Armstrong
Technical Sales
Pathway Connectivity

Its close, but does not speak ACN or Net2: Projects - LLA - LLA Intro

I have never used it, but have heard some success. You guys played with it in the lab Robert?

 

[millamber]

David, give me a call, we have found a workable solution for this exact problem.

The Vista will not output ACN, but there are a few options available. One is to flash your ETC Net2 Nodes to run Pathport protocol then simply use them as Artnet devices. You would have to configure them using pathport manager instead of NCE, but it is doable. Note this will effectively kill your warranty and support for the ETC nodes, as they would be Pathport nodes in everything but the name on the plate.

Secondly, there is a device on the market distributed by TMB called LumenRadio Nova FX that is a wireless system that will accept any protocol in (DMX, Artnet, sACN, Net2) and will output any protocol out. We demo/tested one of these units in a situation exact to yours with a Vista front end sending Artnet to the LumenRadio devices which outputted Net2 to the dimmers and moving lights. It took a bit to get setup correctly, but once we did it worked flawlessly. It is a line of sight device, but you could put both the transmitter and receiver next to each other in an equipment rack and use cabling to get signal to/from them.

 

[Footer]

David, give me a call, we have found a workable solution for this exact problem.

The Vista will not output ACN, but there are a few options available. One is to flash your ETC Net2 Nodes to run Pathport protocol then simply use them as Artnet devices. You would have to configure them using pathport manager instead of NCE, but it is doable. Note this will effectively kill your warranty and support for the ETC nodes, as they would be Pathport nodes in everything but the name on the plate.

Secondly, there is a device on the market distributed by TMB called LumenRadio Nova FX that is a wireless system that will accept any protocol in (DMX, Artnet, sACN, Net2) and will output any protocol out. We demo/tested one of these units in a situation exact to yours with a Vista front end sending Artnet to the LumenRadio devices which outputted Net2 to the dimmers and moving lights. It took a bit to get setup correctly, but once we did it worked flawlessly. It is a line of sight device, but you could put both the transmitter and receiver next to each other in an equipment rack and use cabling to get signal to/from them.

Can the same flash be done with Strand SN110 nodes? I have two of them laying around and have not been within 5 miles of a strand console in several years. Having them speak raw ACN or Artnet would be great.

 

[Rob]

Its close, but does not speak ACN or Net2: Projects - LLA - LLA Intro

I have never used it, but have heard some success. You guys played with it in the lab Robert?

Kyle,

No, I haven't played around with this. It looks as though the project may have been dormant for a while, though that doesn't mean it doesn't work.

This kind of conversion is on our development list, but we also feel the best approach for the industry is to migrate to sACN. Its multicast capabilities provide the needed support for slower (ie 10Mbit) nodes when used in large universe setups. With support for 64,000 universes, it shouldn't run out of room soon. (Presenting all that information will be the next issue.) And like DMX, being a standard, it should make these compatibility problems go away.

As for your SN110s, unfortunately they will speak nothing but Shownet. It's disappointing that even the N21 has no support for anything other than Shownet.

Robert.

Robert Armstrong
Technical Sales
Pathway Connectivity

 

[Footer]

As for your SN110s, unfortunately they will speak nothing but Shownet. It's disappointing that even the N21 has no support for anything other than Shownet.

Well, it was a thought at least. Very disappointing considering the nodes were sold as "ACN Ready". Well, at least Chamsys speaks shownet so the nodes to get some use. Thanks!

 

[SteveB]

David, give me a call, we have found a workable solution for this exact problem.

The Vista will not output ACN, but there are a few options available. One is to flash your ETC Net2 Nodes to run Pathport protocol then simply use them as Artnet devices. You would have to configure them using pathport manager instead of NCE, but it is doable. Note this will effectively kill your warranty and support for the ETC nodes, as they would be Pathport nodes in everything but the name on the plate.

Secondly, there is a device on the market distributed by TMB called LumenRadio Nova FX that is a wireless system that will accept any protocol in (DMX, Artnet, sACN, Net2) and will output any protocol out. We demo/tested one of these units in a situation exact to yours with a Vista front end sending Artnet to the LumenRadio devices which outputted Net2 to the dimmers and moving lights. It took a bit to get setup correctly, but once we did it worked flawlessly. It is a line of sight device, but you could put both the transmitter and receiver next to each other in an equipment rack and use cabling to get signal to/from them.

Big issues I see with this is converting to Pathport means the OP needs to place (somewhere) a Pathport node to drive DMX to the Sensor racks that currently listen to Net2 via the CEM+'s. That means re-wiring the racks for daisy-chained DMX, as they are currently all home-run to a switch with Cat5. . Or have a device/node ? that will then convert ArtNet to Net2. Seems like a lot of work.

Also not going to work if any of the nodes in use are the Net2 4 port units, which were not built by Pathway and which are not convertible.