DMX Cable

[Pav636]

Hey guys, I know this topic has came up before, but I wanted to see if any one has any reviews on the Elation Professional DMX cable. Not the accu-cable but the pro line which is made for production companies.

The only thing I don't like is that it does not have neutrik ends. A lot of roadies drop them and wanted to see the reability.

http://www.elationlighting.com/ProductDetails.aspx?ItemNumber=1863&MainId=1&Category=33

Thanks,
-Pav

 

[BillESC]

It's still an import. Neutrik is the way to go.

 

[Pav636]

It's still an import. Neutrik is the way to go.

Hi Bill, thanks but elation is known not known to really create any crappy items, that was the reason why I was looking into it.

 

[gafftaper]

I haven't used them but my guess would be they would be just fine for most theater applications, but not as durable as some of the heavier duty products out there with Neutrik connectors when it comes to a serious road tour test. Elation is a fine company but when a product costs less they have to cut a corner somewhere, in this case my guess would be they aren't quite as durable. Will the difference matter to the typical user? Probably not.

Nothing against Elation, but when a company has a Pro version that tells me that the basic version is for high school DJs, the pro version is good enough for most theaters, but not actually good enough for really high end pros.

 

[SteveB]

Hey guys, I know this topic has came up before, but I wanted to see if any one has any reviews on the Elation Professional DMX cable. Not the accu-cable but the pro line which is made for production companies.

The only thing I don't like is that it does not have neutrik ends. A lot of roadies drop them and wanted to see the reability.

http://www.elationlighting.com/ProductDetails.aspx?ItemNumber=1863&MainId=1&Category=33

Thanks,
-Pav

Why, oh why is it 3 pin ?. This gets tiring to say, but the international standard for DMX connectors is 5 pin. Even calling this "DMX" is incorrect as the standard is clear. Are not Elation units equipped with 5 pin connectors ?. They are merely saving pennies and would be one of the reasons to not buy this. If they cut corners here, they'll cur corners elsewhere on items that matter.

Here's a scenario. You buy 3 pin lighting data cable and an event rolls in with a 5 pin opto-splitter. If you don't have adapters (which are another expense) you can't use any of the 3 pin cable. If the fixtures are equipped with 5 pin connectors then buy 5 pin cable and keep everything to the standard.

Rant over, steps down off platform.

 

[Pav636]

Why, oh why is it 3 pin ?. This gets tiring to say, but the international standard for DMX connectors is 5 pin. Even calling this "DMX" is incorrect as the standard is clear. Are not Elation units equipped with 5 pin connectors ?. They are merely saving pennies and would be one of the reasons to not buy this. If they cut corners here, they'll cur corners elsewhere on items that matter.

Here's a scenario. You buy 3 pin lighting data cable and an event rolls in with a 5 pin opto-splitter. If you don't have adapters (which are another expense) you can't use any of the 3 pin cable. If the fixtures are equipped with 5 pin connectors then buy 5 pin cable and keep everything to the standard.

Rant over, steps down off platform.

SteveB, I do use 5 pin also, I was just doing a basic brand review. I bring in all items when we go into a show so there are no surprises.

 

[BillESC]

Gaff and Steve hit the points quite well.

Depending upon your usage, top quality American made DMX cable can be had for only a few penny's a foot more and with Neutrik ends.

 

[Pav636]

Gaff and Steve hit the points quite well.

Depending upon your usage, top quality American made DMX cable can be had for only a few penny's a foot more and with Neutrik ends.

Bill can you recommend any which has a good jacket along with the pvc jacket (Shrink so we can label our cables)

 

[gafftaper]

I find a lot of the quality DMX cable is assembled in the back of your local shop. Drop @BillESC a private message and I bet he can sell you some good stuff he makes himself with high quality cable and Neutrik connectors.

Edit: I take the "Like" from Bill on this message as a yes he's happy to sell them to you so call him. And for that matter, I like to remind people to call your local dealer. If they are a decent sized operation, they will probably be happy to make you some nice quality DMX cables as well. Remember, even if it costs you a few bucks extra, if you don't support your local dealer they won't be there when you need them.

 

[len]

I have a bunch of stuff Bill made for me in 2005 and it's still all good as new. I don't think it was any more $$ than anything else, and he guarantees it for life (at least he did). Too bad it isn't guaranteed from being stolen. Anyway, I'd ask him for a quote.

As for the 3-pin, 5-pin thing. Yes, there is a standard. But if the lights are all 3-pin, the dimmers are 3-pin, and the desk is 3-pin, having 5-pin cable is a bit of a pain.

 

[Floobydust]

I've had excellent results from Lex products, with both 3 pin and 5 pin connectors.

 

[bishopthomas]

I make my own cables as well. All Neutrik connectors and all 3 pin.

 

[bdkdesigns]

Are not Elation units equipped with 5 pin connectors

Steve, all of my LED PARs by them are 5 pin, but my Design Spot 250's are only 3 pin. I also have a Martin Jem fogger that is three pin as well as a non-dim Martin control box. I always try to put my 3 pin at the end of the line.

 

[StradivariusBone]

Does anyone make a 3 wire cable with 5 pin xlr? It always seemed like a waste of good copper, but important to use the 5 pin for reasons mentioned above as well as mechanically avoiding plugging it into a +48v line.

 

[SteveB]

Steve, all of my LED PARs by them are 5 pin, but my Design Spot 250's are only 3 pin. I also have a Martin Jem fogger that is three pin as well as a non-dim Martin control box. I always try to put my 3 pin at the end of the line.

Been there. My 8 High End units are all 3 pin. I have gotten into it over on the LightNetwork with Scott Blair, when (he might still be) with High End over the fact that they were still shipping Studio Spots with 3 pin. He attempted do defend the practice along the lines of "backwards compatible". I lambasted the practice along the lines of "requires 2 DMX 3/5 adapters per fixture". Stupid in my mind but something we all deal with and is why I have a drawer full of adapters.

 

[Wood4321]

Been there. My 8 High End units are all 3 pin. I have gotten into it over on the LightNetwork with Scott Blair, when (he might still be) with High End over the fact that they were still shipping Studio Spots with 3 pin. He attempted do defend the practice along the lines of "backwards compatible". I lambasted the practice along the lines of "requires 2 DMX 3/5 adapters per fixture". Stupid in my mind but something we all deal with and is why I have a drawer full of adapters.

Wow, I would think I would remember that post on LN. Scott as far as I can recall has always been a stauch proponent of 5 pin, even on High end equipment. That being said, the Studio 575 was designed early enough that many/most fixtures were still using 3pin. And from what I understand, Neutrik doesn't make a compatible replacement for the panel mount connector in those fixtures. Plus, it would be a nightmare for any rental house. "Do you have the 3 pin studio color or 5 pin?"

 

[SteveB]

Wow, I would think I would remember that post on LN. Scott as far as I can recall has always been a stauch proponent of 5 pin, even on High end equipment. That being said, the Studio 575 was designed early enough that many/most fixtures were still using 3pin. And from what I understand, Neutrik doesn't make a compatible replacement for the panel mount connector in those fixtures. Plus, it would be a nightmare for any rental house. "Do you have the 3 pin studio color or 5 pin?"

But not particularly hard for to semi-permanently tie-wrap 3 to 5 adapters to whatever SS's still had 3 pin, which is what I had to do anyway. My admitted attitude problem was it was literally YEARS after 5 pin had become the standard that they still equipped the fixture this way. Still do as far as I know. Which is one reason I went to Martin fixtures.

Scott is as BTW, a very nice guy, I think he just found himself trapped in this argument defending a policy of HES that he knew was a problem for the customers.

 

[Wood4321]

But not particularly hard for to semi-permanently tie-wrap 3 to 5 adapters to whatever SS's still had 3 pin, which is what I had to do anyway. My admitted attitude problem was it was literally YEARS after 5 pin had become the standard that they still equipped the fixture this way. Still do as far as I know. Which is one reason I went to Martin fixtures.

Right, But surely you can see the inherent problem with changing an established fixture mid production run? Any rental company would have freaked out if they made that sort of a change. Subrentals would be a complete nightmare. Of course they still ship them with 3 pin, as that is what they were designed with. Just like the Martin Mac 500/600. The only real difference here is that the Studio 575 line had a much longer production lifetime than the martin products of the same era.

 

[SteveB]

Right, But surely you can see the inherent problem with changing an established fixture mid production run? Any rental company would have freaked out if they made that sort of a change. Subrentals would be a complete nightmare. Of course they still ship them with 3 pin, as that is what they were designed with. Just like the Martin Mac 500/600. The only real difference here is that the Studio 575 line had a much longer production lifetime than the martin products of the same era.

All sorts of gear switches over mid production run. Consoles get different hardware when older motherboards or parts are no longer available, witness the Ion that has a completely different rear connector board from the early models. Shops have to remember that certain units need a DVI splitter, others don't. Other parts turn out to not be as reliable and a fix is needed so parts are different, how many times have you been asked for a serial number so the manufacturer could look up if it was before or after a parts change. All the time. The Source 4 ellipsoidal is another case in point with many changes made that affect the shops. You just deal with it.

As to my opinion about the HE decision, it's a case of not being an industry leader and following the industry standard, which just compounds the problem. For everybody that uses the fixture, including everybody who has had a comment on this post and deals with cheap stuff that uses 3 pin. If the big guys can't be bothered then it must be OK. Shops that continue to buy the fixture will have to stock even more adapters as well as train everybody that "Oh it's an SS, that's 3 pin", when about everything else in the shop is now at 5, or at least has both. That probably affects the buyers at the shops decisions down the road as well.

As a consumer I don't really care why the company doesn't want to switch and I have always doubted the rational that no connector was available. It really came down to an economics issue for HE, they just didn't want to have to pay the price to switch over. That's OK as I stopped buying HE 'cause I didn't like that attitude.

 

[Wood4321]

Right, but an internal parts change is completely different than a functional change like the dmx connector! I guess we will have to agree to disagree on this one. I cant think of a single fixture that has ever made a change such as you are suggesting.
The only thing that is even close is VL switching over to powercon on their fixtures mid run. And to be honest, that still isn't really a change, since most people will just leave the tail attached to the fixture.

And having worked at a rental house, having different versions of a fixture IS a problem.

As for costs, there likely was little to no cost difference. The dmx board was built with holes for a 5 pin connector (which afaik neutrik never produced in the format studio 575 used)

I believe with near certainty that Martin or clay Paky or any other manufacturer would have made the same decision.