Automated Fixtures Vari-lite VL440 as entry-level movers?

[TJCornish]

I'm an audio guy sliding over into lighting. I produce conferences in the HOW world for between 300 and 700 people. I have a bunch of 575w lekos and a bunch of Chauvet SlimPar Pro RGBA LED pars that seem to do well with the brightness of my 575w lekos (mostly Strand Centurys - a few old style S4s). My usual setup is the LED pars illuminating a scrim and the lekos both gelled ungelled for front wash light. I'm using mostly 36 degree fixtures and throw distances are generally 10' to the front of the stage, 30' to the back of the stage.

I'm causally interested in movers as I've found gobo projection to be pretty neat (yes, I've made it all the way up to '60's hi-tech lighting), and I would like to take advantage of all the other cool stuff - less focusing on ladders, reduced fixture count, etc.

Where should I be looking to get started? I was originally looking at Mac 250 Entours, but a friend suggested that they aren't up to the task, and suggested the VL440 at a minimum. I certainly like the price of the Entours better than around double that for the VL440s, but I understand the buy once, cry once principle, and could make use of the zoom feature of the VL, in addition to the extra brightness.

The HPL575 lamp I'm using in my lekos seems to be rated at 14,000 lumens - not sure if this is "out the lens" lumens, or bulb lumens. The VL440 is 9,000. Am I already in trouble? I would like to use these occasionally as key lights, but often as backdrop candy.

I don't need to worry too much about video, but I do need the fixtures to run on 120v.

Thanks for any thoughts.

 

[Wood4321]

While I have heard good things about the 440/770/880 series I have not seen them in person.
That being said, are you sure you need a moving fixture? You will get a lot more for your money if you buy more S4's, or if you want to add some nice features, buy some of the new S4 LED fixtures.

What lighting console are you currently using? This also might be a good place to upgrade before you start purchasing moving lights.

As for brightness, while I have not seen the 440, the Studio Spot 575 has a similar number of lumens to the 440, and I have not had any problems with the brightness of them vs a stage wash. But to be honest, I would demo them first, to get an idea if they are the right fixture for you.

Or, if you could also go the used route, There are tons of Studio Spots, Studio Colors, and Technobeams right here in minneapolis for sale.

 

[Morte615]

If what you are really interested in currently is a moving Gobo then I would recommend a Right-Arm. You can use one of the 575w lekos that you already own, place whatever gobo and gel you like, then shoot it all around the room. If you are just getting into moving fixtures I feel the Right-Arm (or similar, though not sure what else there is that does the same thing) is a great way to get started and learn how to control a mover. And if you get an LED source light then you can even get color changing and the other items you get with LED!

 

[TJCornish]

I have an ETC SmartFade ML.

I'm pretty saturated with Lekos - if I add anything, other than one or two more new 750W S4s for static key gobos, it's time for intelligent stuff. I'm looking at these for effect lighting, too - more than just static gobo projection.

I've considered the used route, but have heard horror stories about buying used and/or older movers. New fixtures that haven't been previously beat on are pretty attractive. I keep my gear in really good condition, and pretty much every time I buy used I'm unhappy. Of those in your list, are any particularly hardy that they could still be worth owning? I've heard mixed things about the HES stuff.

 

[Wood4321]

Studio Spot 575 and Studio Color 575 are pretty rugged fixtures.
Both are pretty easy to work on, and there are tons of them out there on the used market.
Parts are mostly inexpensive, with a few exceptions. (Lamp power supply, Logic Card, CMY Wheels)
Just stay away from the Studio Spot CMY versions, they are noisy, and the glass for the color mixing system is very thin and extremely expensive.

In any case, Do NOT purchase Xspots, from anyone... Ever.

Other Used fixtures I would think about....
VL2500 Spot and Wash, Should be able to get them for around 4k-6k each.
Good light, 700 watt short arc. Pretty bright good feature set.

Mac 700 spot and wash
Heard good things, the spot has an animation wheel.
But they are a bit more expensive on the used market than the VL's

Mac 101
Ok, not really in the same ballpark, but I freaking love this light.
Tiny, RGB LED, 8lbs, Bright, Cheap! $1400-1600 on the used market.

*Edit,
Now that I think about it, I would think about purchasing some Apollo Gobo Rotators for your S4's Even if you do end up buying some movers, that would be a nice bit of kit to add to your arsenal.

 

[TJCornish]

Now that I think about it, I would think about purchasing some Apollo Gobo Rotators for your S4's Even if you do end up buying some movers, that would be a nice bit of kit to add to your arsenal.

I looked up the Gobo rotator. Holy Cow! It costs almost as much as the S4 does! that and the fact that it needs non-dimmed power are probably deal breakers for me.

 

[Pie4Weebl]

I had a demo with the new VLs recently. I think you will be pleased with the output of the fixtures. If you finesse your front light some you should be able to get some nice looks for backlight and candy. They should be also pretty amazing for backdrop candy and do loads more than a source four on a right arm could do.


But if you have someone right there in town who will sell you some used ones and then service them when issues come up that could be a better value (even though studio spots don't come close to the new VLs)

 

[Synchronize]

I would recommend looking into renting units as needed. If you can strike up a relationship with a local rental company, and you rent often, you can usually get some pretty good prices (depending on where you are). Then you don't have to worry about stuff like pricey lamps, maintenance, and repairs.

 

[bishopthomas]

I would recommend looking into renting units as needed. If you can strike up a relationship with a local rental company, and you rent often, you can usually get some pretty good prices (depending on where you are). Then you don't have to worry about stuff like pricey lamps, maintenance, and repairs.

I would whole-heartedly disagree with this. The cost of lamps, maintenance, and repairs will be offset by the lack of picking up (or especially delivery of) the gear. You will be the one setting the pricing on the gear you own, thus making you able to be more competitive. If you're worried about lamp costs (probably the most expensive part about buying ML's) buy LED. Learn how to work on them yourself so they don't need to go out of service for weeks WHEN they go down. If you can buy the VL440's new you will not regret it. Purchasing moving lights was by far the best business decision I have ever made.

 

[TJCornish]

I would whole-heartedly disagree with this. The cost of lamps, maintenance, and repairs will be offset by the lack of picking up (or especially delivery of) the gear. You will be the one setting the pricing on the gear you own, thus making you able to be more competitive. If you're worried about lamp costs (probably the most expensive part about buying ML's) buy LED. Learn how to work on them yourself so they don't need to go out of service for weeks WHEN they go down. If you can buy the VL440's new you will not regret it. Purchasing moving lights was by far the best business decision I have ever made.

I'm more on your side of the camp. I understand the principle of renting infrequently used gear, and I do that for things that are specialized, and/or hard to store or use - truss, motors, heavy tripod stands, etc. If I had that mentality about everything, I wouldn't own any gear, and I wouldn't have any gigs.

I'm not scared of lamp replacements. 750 hours will last me years for the types of events I do. My gear is treated well, and though I can understand that complicated fixtures running at high temperatures require service, I'm hoping that buying good equipment the first time will minimize this.

Thanks for all the thoughts so far - I appreciate any and all input.

 

[emoreth]

If you're looking at VL440s, you might also consider the HES Technospot. Yes, they're huge for what they do, but they're less expensive than most fixtures in their class and should do the trick at the throw distances you mentioned.