Automated Fixtures What Moving heads??

[UndefinedGroupUK]

Hey,
My school is going to buy a new lighting desk, to replace the 20 year old strand desk which is beginning to show its age, loosing many a show file dangerously close to curtains as well as well as just not being up to the demands of the school anymore. Therefore we have decided to upgrade to an ETC Elements 40, which can operate moving lights. We are therefore looking for some moving heads which we can use.

We are looking for some moving heads which we can buy 2-4 of at a relitively low cost, as the budget isn't huge, we don't feel because the room is so large and the rigs so high that noise is a problem nor is speed a big issue, however we are looking for something which we can control from the express, we can insert custom gobo's and will require as minimum servicing as possible, any help on this matter would be fantastic as our knowlege of moving heads is somewhat lacking and apart from the industry standard Mac250 we don't know whats good and whats not.

Thanks.

 

[Footer]

Not to sidetrack you and say you should not buy moving heads.... but.... take a read: Gafftaper Method - ControlBooth

 

[MNicolai]

What's your budget?

 

[SteveB]

Not to sidetrack you and say you should not buy moving heads.... but.... take a read: Gafftaper Method - ControlBooth

Very good advice here. As well, before you settle on a console, consider that making the moving light work efficiantly REQUIRES a control desk that allows that efficiancy. Folks at ETC will be the first to tell you that the Element is designed for conventional control with "some" ML control, where as the next level - the Ion really works much better at ML's and LED's and such. Before you settle on the Element, based purely on price, get a demo for it in the theater, as well as test driving the Ion and maybe a Strand, if the local dealer supports Strand.

Also consider that whatever ML's you buy will someday be in for repair, so maybe consider getting whatever the local shop services and can provide as a rental replacement, or as supplement to existing. FWIW, Martin and VariLite are the 2 most common I see.

 

[ship]

For a budget, I might look into the used Mac 600 range given the Mac 2K line is now coming up for resale these days in replacement. Much work done with Mac 600 in the past and if you go long life lamp, very cost effective fixture.

 

[metti]

SteveB makes a good point about choosing brands that your local dealer/rental house works with. While not on par with Martin and Vari-Lite gear, Elation is much more affordable, pretty decent, and could very well be available locally.

 

[UndefinedGroupUK]

Hey, thanks for all the replies, our buget is looking at about 2K per light but we can stretch, however unfortunatly however we can't change the desk from an element as that decision has been made from a higher place and we just have to work with it. The same people have also said that moving heads are the way they want to go, so although scrollers and other fasten on feature style units would be more effective, its not the option the boss wants to go for.

 

[mstaylor]

Hey, thanks for all the replies, our buget is looking at about 2K per light but we can stretch, however unfortunatly however we can't change the desk from an element as that decision has been made from a higher place and we just have to work with it. The same people have also said that moving heads are the way they want to go, so although scrollers and other fasten on feature style units would be more effective, its not the option the boss wants to go for.

Ahh, the old problem of the guys on high buying what they want with no regard to what is best for the application. I would suggest trying to fly the ION and rent movers instead of buying. You could use the extra money from not buying lights and apply it to the ION. You could also buy a couple of extra ND modules for your dimmers to make powering the intended movers.

 

[skienblack]

I would agree. The ION is 100X better to work with than the Element when it comes to ML.

On a side note: Why does no one ever recommend S4 Revolutions? We have a few in addition to some High End units and working with the revs is a joy.

 

[Pie4Weebl]

I would agree. The ION is 100X better to work with than the Element when it comes to ML.

On a side note: Why does no one ever recommend S4 Revolutions? We have a few in addition to some High End units and working with the revs is a joy.

Use a VL1000TS/D and you will never want to touch a "revolution" again!

 

[Footer]

Use a VL1000TS/D and you will never want to touch a "revolution" again!

Added to that the technology is about 7 or more years old and is pretty long in the tooth. Better stuff is out there now. This is the first and what I believe to be last moving light for the stage that ETC will ever make.

 

[SteveB]

Added to that the technology is about 7 or more years old and is pretty long in the tooth. Better stuff is out there now. This is the first and what I believe to be last moving light for the stage that ETC will ever make.

This was the topic on the Light Network a while back, with many folks wondering as to why Martin has not (as yet, and likely never, according to the posts) jumped into the incandescent profile moving light market, which is currently Vari-Lite with the VL1000 series, ETC and the Revo and assorted flavors of AutoYoke with Source 4, scroller and DMX iris. Not much else out there that does the same thing if you want incandescent source, thus the VL1000 and the Revo are the go to fixtures, with VariLite seemingly the most widely used and the Revo getting some use, according to the trade journals.

FWIW, from what I've read, the Revo has somewhat better intensity due to not having to punch light thru 3 dichroic flags. Anybody noticed this ?.

 

[Cadmium6855]

Chauvet fixtures are great, I just bought 16 for my school, 4 movers (Q-spot 160 LEDs), they are amazing, they do everything I need. We also bought some other chauvet fixtures, Colorstrips (4) and Slimpar 56s (6) and Scorpian RGXs (2). I also got an Elation Show Designer 2, I don't know if you have already got the console, but the Show Designer 2 is amazing as well, maybe too small for your theater, we use 2 different consoles (one for my new intelligent lights, and one for the dimmers) we can't hook the existing lights into the new ones, unfortunately. But anyway, the chauvet fixtures are great, I got them from " idjnow.com " I called up talked to a guy named Victor and because we were a school he gave us, I think a 25% discount. As for the board we had to get it from a different website " pssl.com " because idjnow had no good boards, but now as I look back on their website I see that they did have a board for me... anyway pssl also gave me a discount, can't remember how much though. Any way point is chauvet fixtures are great the people at both websites are great and helpful and all of the things I bought were wonderful. There was one slight problem with the Chauvet fixtures, I got them on the Monday and I had a show on Thursday and 8 of the fixtures didn't work, I freaked out a little but called idjnow and they called chauvet it turned out there was a manufacturing problem, they got right on sending me replacements and I got them Thursday morning and I was able to use them for the show.

 

[soundlight]

Chauvet fixtures are great, I just bought 16 for my school, 4 movers (Q-spot 160 LEDs), they are amazing, they do everything I need. We also bought some other chauvet fixtures, Colorstrips (4) and Slimpar 56s (6) and Scorpian RGXs (2). I also got an Elation Show Designer 2, I don't know if you have already got the console, but the Show Designer 2 is amazing as well, maybe too small for your theater, we use 2 different consoles (one for my new intelligent lights, and one for the dimmers) we can't hook the existing lights into the new ones, unfortunately. But anyway, the chauvet fixtures are great, I got them from " idjnow.com " I called up talked to a guy named Victor and because we were a school he gave us, I think a 25% discount. As for the board we had to get it from a different website " pssl.com " because idjnow had no good boards, but now as I look back on their website I see that they did have a board for me... anyway pssl also gave me a discount, can't remember how much though. Any way point is chauvet fixtures are great the people at both websites are great and helpful and all of the things I bought were wonderful. There was one slight problem with the Chauvet fixtures, I got them on the Monday and I had a show on Thursday and 8 of the fixtures didn't work, I freaked out a little but called idjnow and they called chauvet it turned out there was a manufacturing problem, they got right on sending me replacements and I got them Thursday morning and I was able to use them for the show.

While those fixtures and that board are great for small concert use, they are all but useless in a true theatre setting. None of those fixtures will be able to keep up with any decently powerful conventional fixture, even an older one with lousy optics. The board, well, let's say that it just wasn't designed for theatre.

For movers for theatre, try to find something that has CMY - used Studio Spot 575 CMYs are still kicking around for a decent price, and those things are built like tanks. When they have an issue, it's usually just a quick motor replacement issue and the motors are really cheap.

 

[Cadmium6855]

While those fixtures and that board are great for small concert use, they are all but useless in a true theatre setting. None of those fixtures will be able to keep up with any decently powerful conventional fixture, even an older one with lousy optics. The board, well, let's say that it just wasn't designed for theatre.

For movers for theatre, try to find something that has CMY - used Studio Spot 575 CMYs are still kicking around for a decent price, and those things are built like tanks. When they have an issue, it's usually just a quick motor replacement issue and the motors are really cheap.

Its true that the board was not the smartest decision for theater but I am also on student council, I am in charge of everything technical, lights, audio, ect. we do a lot of concerts and things, and so I bought these for dual use. Our theater is small and the lights that I bought are as bright as most of our elips. there old strands but still, they work great, when I do a show in the theater I use all of the fixtures, and have 2 operators/ programers, because I run all the intelligent lights and my friend runs and focuses all our old conventional fixtures. It is really what works best for you, this is what works for me and if what works for you is different than that is what works for you.

 

[venuetech]

hey whatever works for you, but you will be moving on soon and without a lot of tender loving care the rig you have built will fall into disrepair. Things like those old strands continue working as long as you keep lamps for them. in your senior year make sure you have good documentation of your rig to pass to the next tech. Think about what the next tech is going to need to get him started and or keep the rig running. (spare lamps,color etc...)

 

[kiwitechgirl]

Any way point is chauvet fixtures are great the people at both websites are great and helpful and all of the things I bought were wonderful. There was one slight problem with the Chauvet fixtures, I got them on the Monday and I had a show on Thursday and 8 of the fixtures didn't work, I freaked out a little but called idjnow and they called chauvet it turned out there was a manufacturing problem, they got right on sending me replacements and I got them Thursday morning and I was able to use them for the show.

Sigh. I don't know where to start. Those fixtures may serve you OK - but I love that eight of them didn't work straight out of the box! - but they are DJ fixtures, not theatre fixtures - the name of the website you bought them from is a dead giveaway....Go to any halfway decent hire company which has a focus on theatre and corporate gigs, not DJ gigs, and I would be very, very surprised if there was a single Chauvet fixture in their hire stock. If you go down to one of my two local hire companies - and let's not forget that I'm in a city of 400,000 in a country of 4 million, so we're not talking massive business here - you won't find anything except Martin, High End and VariLite fixtures. They're bright, they're reliable, and if they do break down, they're not too difficult to fix and you can always get parts. Chauvet have their place - but it ain't in theatre.

To the OP: I wouldn't really go near anything other than the three brands I listed above - someone near you will have that kind of gear in stock if you need to swap a dead unit out, and there's bound to be someone who can service them for you, plus they're well-known and reliable. I have a secret love for the old High End StudioSpot 250s, but I don't think they're being built any more, and existing units are probably now getting a bit old to be completely reliable - I'd be a bit wary of buying second-hand ones.