Attaching a 50', 14 AWG extension cord to a wall

[turtle7896]

Hmm, where have I seen this before??

View attachment 22896

Haha, thanks again man.

 

[turtle7896]

There is no reason to search high and low for IG receptacles for LED stage lighting. Isolated Ground is for reducing hum/ground loops/noise in audio/video systems. It is unnecessary for lighting, and connecting lighting fixtures to IG receptacles will very likely compromise the integrity of your isolated ground system by introducing additional paths for ground loops into the audio system.

The best method would be to have an electrician disconnect a circuit from each lighting position, at the ENR24 rack, and feed those circuits instead from a standard panelboard. Since dimmer racks are usually located in electrical rooms with other panelboards, this is probably not a significant amount of work and an electrician could probably complete it within a day or two. Then you would have a constant-on circuit at each lighting position. If you needed 2 circuits instead of 1 at each lighting position, that's likely not that much more expensive so long as you have some spare capacity in another panelboard. By the time an electrician shows up on-site and starts performing the work, the relative cost of some extra conductors and circuit breakers is marginal once they're already there and set up to do the work.

Here is what we are working with. There is another panel in the basement, but as it may be evident, we would probably not be able to work with it.

 

[SteveB]

I'd skip dealing with the ENR, hire a licensed electrician to add a breaker to that CB panel amd run conduit to an outlet where you need it. Maybe use a breaker designed to be used as a switch.

 

[techieman33]

If this is a theatre covered by NEC article 520, portable cord wiring is considered "portable" not "temporary" which is specifically covered by article 590 and generally refers to construction sites and the like. The requirements for cables in a theatre fall under 520.68 Conductors for Portables. There are also specific rules in 520.5(B) Wiring Methods--Portable Equipment.

ST

Thanks for that info.

I'd skip dealing with the ENR, hire a licensed electrician to add a breaker to that CB panel amd run conduit to an outlet where you need it. Maybe use a breaker designed to be used as a switch.

If your doing all that might as well have the electrician put a switch somewhere convenient to switch the power for them. Make it a key switch or put a cover over it and label it so it doesn't get turned off and on by accident.

 

[turtle7896]

Thanks for all of the ideas and the help fellas. I might go with mircostar's idea of having the dimmers converted to a non-dim, but if it would be more ergonomic to run a piece of conduit up the wall, and then take an Edison - power-con right into it, we may do that. We also need to deal with what I previously mentioned about the LEDs in our balcony, so it may even be a combination of modifying dimmers/putting in a new outlet.

 

[JimmyM]

Another option could be to bypass the dimmer and use the existing lines and tie them into the breaker panel instead, seems like it would be a fairly inexpensive swap for an electrician.

 

[SteveB]

Another option could be to bypass the dimmer and use the existing lines and tie them into the breaker panel instead, seems like it would be a fairly inexpensive swap for an electrician.

Good idea. It looks like the load circuits feed out the top of the packs thru the raceway. Easy to remove from the dimmer lug, pull back to the raceway, splice an extension, add a conduit from raceway to breaker panel, add a breaker(s) and be done. Thats maybe an hours work and a lot easier than getting adapted ENR modules from LiteTrol, even though they are my favorite people.

 

[Les]

I would go a step further and connect an ETC ColorSource Relay at the end of your new conduit run, and then connect your fixtures to that. Then you don't have to run your fixture's power supplies 24/7 even when "off" (a practice which makes my eye twitch). The CS relay has DMX I/O so you loop your signal from that to each of your fixtures. It's bit of money but would be worth it in the long run.

Maybe this has been discussed earlier and I overlooked it in which case, carry on.

 

[microstar]

I would go a step further and connect an ETC ColorSource Relay at the end of your new conduit run, and then connect your fixtures to that. Then you don't have to run your fixture's power supplies 24/7 even when "off" (a practice which makes my eye twitch). The CS relay has DMX I/O so you loop your signal from that to each of your fixtures. It's bit of money but would be worth it in the long run.

Maybe this has been discussed earlier and I overlooked it in which case, carry on.

It may be in his other thread, but @turtle7896 is already using ColorSource Relays, it's just that they are being fed from his dimmed circuits now, which of course is not desirable.

 

[turtle7896]

Colortran ENR24

Hey, so, 3 questions.1. Does anyone know when Colortran released the ENR24?2. Where can I get bulbs for Colortran spotlights?3. Good idea to mix an ETC Element (1), Colortran ENR24, and ETC ColorSource PAR lights together?Thanks for any help.(P.S. I am a highschooler and we are...

www.controlbooth.com

 

[SteveB]

Colortran ENR24

Hey, so, 3 questions.1. Does anyone know when Colortran released the ENR24?2. Where can I get bulbs for Colortran spotlights?3. Good idea to mix an ETC Element (1), Colortran ENR24, and ETC ColorSource PAR lights together?Thanks for any help.(P.S. I am a highschooler and we are...

www.controlbooth.com

My Colortran catalog dated 1992 has the ENR in it.

Assuming Colortran ellipsoidal spotlights ?, the 575w medium 2 pin alternative is the GLC or some versions of that.

The ColorSource fixtures are pretty tolerant of being powered on an SCR dimmer run at full, though relay or constant power is recommended.

 

[Les]

It may be in his other thread, but @turtle7896 is already using ColorSource Relays, it's just that they are being fed from his dimmed circuits now, which of course is not desirable.

Thanks for clarifying. I thought I had seen that, but between the two threads, I got my wires crossed.

 

[STEVETERRY]

Constant modules usually can't be switched via dmx, they are just a hard passthrough with a circuit breaker. Relay modules can be switched via dmx, but it's only on/off hence the term "relay". Non-dim is just a general term used to describe a module that doesn't have dimming capabilities.

I hate to be the bearer of electrical bad tidings, but this discussion omits a serious issue: "fault current coordination".

Dimmers with chokes provide inherent limitation of fault current. The design of the power system feeding a dimmer rack was no doubt based on a a specific fault current rating for that rack. It might have been 50,000 amps, or even 100,000 amps RMS symmetrical. This was based on the inherent "built-in" fault current limitation of dimmers with chokes.

Once you remove those chokes and use "breaker only" modules, your fault current rating for the entire rack falls to the rating of a single branch breaker itself, which might be as low as 5,000 amps RMS symmetrical. This could create an unsafe condition in the event of a fault.

So, what is the solution? "Constant Power" or relay modules must include fuses with sufficient interrupting capacity so that their use does not invalidate the original fault current rating of the rack.

Caveat emptor! Or put another way, TANSTAAFL!

ST

 

[Gage]

I hate to be the bearer of electrical bad tidings, but this discussion omits a serious issue: "fault current coordination".

Dimmers with chokes provide inherent limitation of fault current. The design of the power system feeding a dimmer rack was no doubt based on a a specific fault current rating for that rack. It might have been 50,000 amps, or even 100,000 amps RMS symmetrical. This was based on the inherent "built-in" fault current limitation of dimmers with chokes.

Once you remove those chokes and use "breaker only" modules, your fault current rating for the entire rack falls to the rating of a single branch breaker itself, which might be as low as 5,000 amps RMS symmetrical. This could create an unsafe condition in the event of a fault.

So, what is the solution? "Constant Power" or relay modules must include fuses with sufficient interrupting capacity so that their use does not invalidate the original fault current rating of the rack.

Caveat emptor! Or put another way, TANSTAAFL!

ST

I'm not sure if I would call it bad tidings. Any correction in the name of safety is a good one!

 

[SteveB]

I hate to be the bearer of electrical bad tidings, but this discussion omits a serious issue: "fault current coordination".

Dimmers with chokes provide inherent limitation of fault current. The design of the power system feeding a dimmer rack was no doubt based on a a specific fault current rating for that rack. It might have been 50,000 amps, or even 100,000 amps RMS symmetrical. This was based on the inherent "built-in" fault current limitation of dimmers with chokes.

Once you remove those chokes and use "breaker only" modules, your fault current rating for the entire rack falls to the rating of a single branch breaker itself, which might be as low as 5,000 amps RMS symmetrical. This could create an unsafe condition in the event of a fault.

So, what is the solution? "Constant Power" or relay modules must include fuses with sufficient interrupting capacity so that their use does not invalidate the original fault current rating of the rack.

Caveat emptor! Or put another way, TANSTAAFL!

ST

Can we assume though that a swap of maybe 1 module, with the rest remaining as dimmers, might not be a problem ? I can certainly see an issue if the entire rack got swapped.

 

[Jay Ashworth]

Can we assume though that a swap of maybe 1 module, with the rest remaining as dimmers, might not be a problem ? I can certainly see an issue if the entire rack got swapped.

Indeed, @STEVETERRY; it's not clear from your posting whether that change in rating comes from replacing *all*, *some*, or *only one* dimmer with a relay/passthrough module.

 

[STEVETERRY]

Indeed, @STEVETERRY; it's not clear from your posting whether that change in rating comes from replacing *all*, *some*, or *only one* dimmer with a relay/passthrough module.

The reduction in rack fault current rating only needs ONE module to be changed to a choke-less implementation. In such a case, the WHOLE RACK's fault current rating is reduced.

Realize why:

If a rack has 50,000 amps of available fault current on say, a 600A feeder, all the branch breakers in that rack need to be able to safely interrupt 50,000 amps on a short circuit. A typical 20A breaker is incapable of that. So, the fault current available to the breaker needs to be reduced. In a typical dimmer rack , this occurs due to the I-squared-R losses of the choke in the dimmer. If that choke is not there, say in a constant or relay module, we need to add a fuse capable of safely clearing the high fault current.

What happens to branch breakers exposed to fault current that exceeds their rating? They can self-destruct, and not safely clear the short circuit.

ST

 

[STEVETERRY]

Can we assume though that a swap of maybe 1 module, with the rest remaining as dimmers, might not be a problem ? I can certainly see an issue if the entire rack got swapped.

NO. Please see my post to Jay Ashworth.

ST

 

[SteveB]

NO. Please see my post to Jay Ashworth.

ST

What you are telling us is that installing a single CCR module in a rack makes the rack out of code compliance. Why is ETC selling these then, unless the CCR has a fuse ??

 

[STEVETERRY]

What you are telling us is that installing a single CCR module in a rack makes the rack out of code compliance. Why is ETC selling these then, unless the CCR has a fuse ??

ETC Sensor CC15 and CC20 constant current modules have fuses. From their data sheet:

RATINGS
• 100,000A Short Circuit Current Rating (SCCR)
• Replaceable fuse for short circuit protection and fault
current coordination
• UL and cUL LISTED

ST