Budget DMX controller for LEDs

[daddygreene]

I'm so confused!!!!!!! I have purchased 16 LED Par64 10mm cans for my high school son's rock band and will add a few effects lights along the way. I haven't purchased a controller yet, but need a good but simple controller to run the lights on. I want something simple that doesn't take a HUGE learning curve but that will get the job done (I'm not a light guy). I also would like to let my 9 year old son help me run lights so he can feel apart of the experience and step out of big brother's shadow a bit. A family affair...

My budget is getting thin. I've already purchased new PA, mixer, XLR cables, DMX cables, road cases, trailer, LED lights and now the final thing (I hope) is a user friendly DMX controller. I'm wanting to get into a controller for $400 or less.

I prefer NOT to go with the computer/software type system namely because of my little one wanting to have a role in the band. He won't be there all the time, but would like him to be able to push some buttons and enjoy it with his brother and father. I do have a couple of older 5-7 year old Windows XP laptops, but have no idea if they would even work with lighting software and I'm NOT purchasing a laptop for lighting software.

I've been told to consider;
Elation/ADJ DMX Operator 192
Elation Operator Pro
Elation Scene Setter 24
Elations Scene Setter 48
Optima Lighting Matrix Stage 16
(used) Show Designer 1 (can't seem to find)

I don't want to buy something that won't allow me to run all the lights I've purchased. I also want to pick up a light or two down the line that has some WOW factor (scanners, lasers, ADJ Majestic moonflower, fogger/hazer, etc...) so I want it to have a little bit of expandability.

Can you guys tell me the Pro's and Con's of some of these fixtures and which in your opinion might fit my scenario the best? I am open to other suggestions, but I need to reach a consensus here fairly soon and order this thing!

I really am looking for DON'T BUY THIS, or THIS WON'T RUN THE LIGHTS YOU'VE PURCHASED, or THIS WILL WORK, etc...! So strong opinions are welcomed. I am really confused so I need clarity!

 

[JD]

If your intent is to add some moving lights / scanners, or such, then that leans against the Scene Setter boards. They would work well with the LED pars, but you need something with a little more oomph to store mover/scanner scenes since they tend to take up a lot of channels.

The Elation Operator Pro would be better but there are only 8 conventional channels for the cans. I don't know which ones you are using but if you are going to set them up as two groups with 4 channels of control, then that would work.

Another option would be to go with two boards. Here's the thing: Scanners can easily use up 16 or more channels per light if you want independent operation.

Something like the Chauvet OBEY 70 or the cheaper Optima equivalent (~ $120) will handle a dozen scanners or movers, each with 16 channels, and allow 240 scenes to be preset. This would be a cheap way to add those kind of lights in the future.

When you are operating a conventional board and conventional lights or LEDs, you are moving faders up to add more light. For scanners and moving lights, you want a swath of channels to suddenly be at specific levels. This is why the two types of boards are different. With the exception of X/Y movement, or fade ins, you want to be able to just push a button and have your look pop up.

One footnote: You can spend $40,000 on a good board. The general rule is the more money you spend, the easier your life will be!

 

[daddygreene]

I'm liking this feedback.... more please!

 

[mstaylor]

If you want to go the mover route, look at LED movers to keep power needs down. Elation comes to mind. STAY AWAY from lasors, too many headaches for not enough return. Hazors are not reall far off from being in the same boat.
Personally I would stick with adding static LEDs and uplight the drums and piano. You can also add small pieces of vertical truss and light those. If you did go with some movers or scans then put them on the same verical trusses.

 

[daddygreene]

Personally I would stick with adding static LEDs and uplight the drums and piano. You can also add small pieces of vertical truss and light those.

I'm assuming this is non-moving lights.
If this is what you mean, I'm leaning that way in my thinking. I've got 16 Par64 10mm cans on the way. I just want something simple that we can fade, bump and have an auto music mode, but it would be a bonus if the controller had a way to program some scenes and chases so that eventually I learn how to do this and add to the performance.

We're just starting this venture so everything is a learning curve. Any suggestions for this type of basic controller? Under $400. Less is better.

 

[MNBallet]

I also would like to let my 9 year old son help me run lights so he can feel apart of the experience and step out of big brother's shadow a bit. A family affair...

My budget is getting thin. I've already purchased new PA, mixer, XLR cables, DMX cables, road cases, trailer, LED lights and now the final thing (I hope) is a user friendly DMX controller. I'm wanting to get into a controller for $400 or less.

I prefer NOT to go with the computer/software type system namely because of my little one wanting to have a role in the band. He won't be there all the time, but would like him to be able to push some buttons and enjoy it with his brother and father. I do have a couple of older 5-7 year old Windows XP laptops, but have no idea if they would even work with lighting software and I'm NOT purchasing a laptop for lighting software.

Please take what I'm about to say with a grain of salt, but I speak from years of professional lighting. I would recomend the software with an old laptop route.

I set up my youth group at church with a bunch of scanners and a few stage lights and gave them the Elation Operator Pro control board. I set up a few programmed chases and then let them have at it. A couple of years later I set up the church main building with some lighting as well and went with the AMDJ My DMX software ($299) The youth leader then wished he had it over at the youth building. The software just makes more sence to young teens, with them growing up more computer savy. The learning curve seems to be much faster on DMX software than on the cheap DJ type boards.
#1 A perfect examle is that on the smaller DJ DMX boards you only get 8 faders. So button page 1 is DMX 1-8, then there is a small A/B button that then turns it to DMX 9 - 16. Page 2 bank A is then DMX 17 - 25, But what if you needed to grab the fader that controlls DMX 52? Quick...is it on page 3 bank B or page 4 bank A? The software route lets you see all 512 DMX channels at once.
#2 Another problem with the same fader controling who knows what of what LED par or scanner is you can't label you light board with how mny times that same fader controlls what. The software route does. In fact, the software even shows you the color (for RGB pars, it will closely show the color mixing for the 3 channels), the gobo icon that will closely resemble the gobo in the unit. All your virtual faders are named and color coded.
#3 If your DJ type light board get lost/stolen/broken you are out. you said you had a couple of old laptops and the software can be put on any/all of them as a backup. You would just have to transfer the USB to DMX device. (granted that if you lost the USB to DMX you would be in the same boat as losing the DJ board)
#4 the software route is easier and quicker to set up effects with pre-programmed stuff. The My DMX will to all the programming with effects like a rainbow across you 16 Pars, with you even picking how many colors and speed. It even has some movment effects for scanners and moving head units.

I really think your 9 year old will grasp the basics of the software route faster than a hard interface DJ board.

this wasn't an ad for AMDJ My DMX, I just happen you use it and like it. I do full stage productions where I have a true theater lighting console but I still use my laptop for effects for the LED pars and movers next to it.

Ken Pogin
Production / Tour Manager
Minnesota Ballet

 

[MarshallPope]

Just to add to what MNBallet said, I too would recommend against a cheapo DJ-style controller. I have a Chauvet board that I use at my church for a halogen color mixing unit, a couple of LED moonflowers, and a couple of dimmer packs. It is a pain to use and program. No matter how many times I have programmed it, I still have to keep the manual handy because there is always a "What the eff is this thing doing" moment or fifty. Trying to run anything live is impossible because of the 8 faders you have to work with and having to keep guessing what fixture is up, what page you are on, what bank you are in, what this fader does, why this fader is where it is, etc. On top of that, if you are trying to move from one light to another, you will reuse the faders and they are never where you want them. To clarify, you may have set fader 1 at 150 for light 1. You switch to light 2 and fader 1 is still at 150, while the light is at 12. There is no way to seamlessly run a show live. For the next little bit I will assume that all boards are like mine for simplicity's sake. Whatever board you may be looking at might not have these drawbacks, but it will likely have some that are comparable. For one thing, there is no way to pick two looks and fade between them on-the-go. You are restricted to predefined chases. There is no way to fade anything that is not next in the chase. There is also no way to program a specific speed to a specific chase. This is all global and must be run live. Also, you are very limited on the number of different looks you can create. Sure, you may be able to program fifty kajillion (approximately) scenes, but you are limited to a half dozen or so chases, which are just about all that you can actually use live.

That being said, if you do choose to use a DJ-type board, it is workable. I have run Vacation Bible Schools on this thing, I have run concerts on it, I have run a Christmas tree (long story) and I have run a slow cycle between pink-purple and less-pink-purple in the baptistry for an Easter cantata. If that's what you get, you will find a way to make it work, and it is definitely better than nothing. However, you may find yourself in a much calmer ocean if you go a different route.

 

[daddygreene]

Why then would it not be better to go with Chamsys for FREE rather than spend the money on the AMDJ MyDMX software?

Is there a place I can download the MyDMX and demo it?
I cleaned off an old laptop today and downloaded the Chamsys on it. I just don't have a clue what I'm doing yet. Heck I don't even know the difference between a scene and a chase hardly! Looks like the learning curve on all this is going to be steep!

What's the advantage of the MyDMX over the Chamsys?

Last question, is there a simple plug and play controller (inexpensive) that would allow us to have the automatic music function and some bumps and faders even if I have to gang several fixtures on a channel just to get us started?

 

[BillESC]

Last question, is there a simple plug and play controller (inexpensive) that would allow us to have the automatic music function and some bumps and faders even if I have to gang several fixtures on a channel just to get us started?

Chauvet's Obey 40 is a simple plug and play controller that's inexpensive and will introduce you to DMX programming. It will store 240 scenes and allow you to create chases both timed and to the music. MAP price is $ 119.99

 

[MNBallet]

Why then would it not be better to go with Chamsys for FREE rather than spend the money on the AMDJ MyDMX software?

Is there a place I can download the MyDMX and demo it?
I cleaned off an old laptop today and downloaded the Chamsys on it. I just don't have a clue what I'm doing yet. Heck I don't even know the difference between a scene and a chase hardly! Looks like the learning curve on all this is going to be steep!

What's the advantage of the MyDMX over the Chamsys?

Last question, is there a simple plug and play controller (inexpensive) that would allow us to have the automatic music function and some bumps and faders even if I have to gang several fixtures on a channel just to get us started?

I do not recomend the Chamsys software for your needs. That software is designed for professionals, it would be like saying you are going to teach a 5 year old how to ride a bike and then hand them the keys to the Porche. Plus the software is free but you still need to get hardware (USB to DMX)

You can download the My DMX software for free from the website.

American DJ Homepage

Chauvet makes a version too:
ShowXpress | CHAUVET Lighting

Both of those you can download and play with it for free. It won't work with your lights until you buy the USB to DMX parts, but it will give you the idea of how much of a learning curve it has.

Kenneth Pogin
Production / Tour Manager
Minnesota Ballet