Conventional Fixtures Date ETC Source 4 Par introduced?
- Thread starterOldschool
- Start date
Memory is fleeting. 1995 for the SourceFour PAR EA, according to ETC | Explore the Source Four | History. Which came first: EA (Enhanced Aluminum) or MCM (Metal Cold Mirror)?
1992, of course, for the SourceFour ERS.
1992, of course, for the SourceFour ERS.
Welcome Richard
And as one of the Old School/Old Timers 'round these here parts, I get to fill you in that a Source 4 is not a Leko. Which is the term applied to the ellipsoidal spotlights as created in the early 1960's by Chuck "LE"vy and Ed "KO"ok, formerly owners of Century Lighting, that became Century-Strand, that became Strand Lighting that became part of Genlyte/Vari*Lite and is now one of the Phillips (yes the lamp manufacturer) brands. The moniker "Leko" is for a fixtures that is sadly no longer made (well, not that sadly).
On the other hand, the term Source 4 is somewhat becoming the replacement term for any similar style ellipsoidal using a 575watt lamp, even though it can also use other lamps.
This is all covered somewhere here on CB, but wife's calling me to dinner.
Steve Bailey
Brooklyn College
And as one of the Old School/Old Timers 'round these here parts, I get to fill you in that a Source 4 is not a Leko. Which is the term applied to the ellipsoidal spotlights as created in the early 1960's by Chuck "LE"vy and Ed "KO"ok, formerly owners of Century Lighting, that became Century-Strand, that became Strand Lighting that became part of Genlyte/Vari*Lite and is now one of the Phillips (yes the lamp manufacturer) brands. The moniker "Leko" is for a fixtures that is sadly no longer made (well, not that sadly).
On the other hand, the term Source 4 is somewhat becoming the replacement term for any similar style ellipsoidal using a 575watt lamp, even though it can also use other lamps.
This is all covered somewhere here on CB, but wife's calling me to dinner.
Steve Bailey
Brooklyn College
Steve of course meant to type "1930s." And it was Joseph Levy. Charles (Chuck) was his son, who eventually took over Century Lighting.
See also Edward Kook obituary and An Oral History Of Theatrical Lighting And Its People.
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My bad, and I admit that I was under the misconception that the first Century ellipsoidal spotlight that used the name "LeKo", was the 1500 series, introduced early 60's , die-cast aluminum, change-able lens tubes for 6x12, 6x9 and 4-1/2x6, as well as a quick release lamp cap. I had thought that the Century ellipsoidals prior were simply called Ellipsoidals. Hmmm....
FWIW, I take exception to the WiKi article - Lekolite - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia that calls a Source 4 a "Source Four Leko". I have NEVER heard anybody refer to an S4 (professionally) as a Leko. pretty much from the get go, it was understood that the S4 was a totally different beast and if you called a shop and wanted Leko's, you'd most likely get an Altman 360 or 360Q, but would not be getting S4's.
Steve B.
shiben
Well-Known Member
Thats odd, because many people around my theaters tend to refer to all ERS instruments as Lekos (we really only have Source 4s tho), although I know this is wrong, but even in some of the more professional settings I have been in the LD has used the term Leko and Source 4 interchangeably. However, never having ever used a true Leko at work, the older hands might just not have changed? I dont know. I will remember this tho and make sure my terminology is correct. Hate to look like an idiot.
First record I have in the PO system (given the current computer system started in '97) was in early 98 for 50 S-4 PAR's bought. A year before I got there so I don't know if those were the first for where I work or not but think it possible.
Pro's touring or from around the shop normally call them "Lekos" if not S-4 Leko in being more proper, this as changed no doubt after the S-4 Par started getting into stock. Think it's even listed as that way also in the request/pull sheets for shows. My feling, it would confuse "the pros" if you called it a ETC S-4 ERS, this plus the remaining Colortran, Altman, and Mole Leko fixtures have been sold off or banished to my private non-existant stock/storage of them and are no longer in active inventory. Ask for a Leko, most production places I think unless CDM, Mini Ellipse or other type of special Leko only carry the S-4 at this point. Plus in requesting the Leko it's as per beam spread and 360Q's didn't do degrees of beam spread.
Pro's are also easily confused by proper terminology in my opionion at least. Only thing that got them stopped from requesting ETC lamps was me giving them ETC lamps - took about a year before that stopped for all and those "pro's learned a detail unimportant to know before. The different wattage lamps helped in that need to learn a term and define what is they need as if they use it for a living and are a professional.
I don't do shows any longer thus I take them to task in their often said example of hard life doing shows. "Ok, if you are hanging 40' in the air up side down from the grid, you are changing a lamp." Agreement that they do so as "pros" in having a hard job. I than go on once I understand their situation sufficiently. "you are calling down to some guy on the floor to get you a HTI 1200 lamp out of the spares box." Yea, ok that works for me. "You in hanging up side down in waiting for say a Mac 2K lamp in asking for a HTI 1200 lamp get a Lycian 1271 lamp." "Wouldn't it be good to memorize while hanging up side down from the grid what the lamp is called that you need?" Yes the agreement the pro should learn his or her lamps better and I am helping them - thanks ship...
Recently helped a "professional" moving light tech person in learning to remember the full lamp description - large difference between say a HTI 1200w/D7/60 and a HTI 1200w/60/P50 in stock and a few years ago when the Mac 2K lamp was a HMI 1200w/S also the HMI 1200w/GS or now HMI 1200w/DXS might come into play as a lamp choice amongst other lamps like the HMI 1200w/SE over the MSR 1200HR in being nice to the guys for different lamp code for the lamp between the two Lycian 1271 verses 1272 spots stocked. Same basic lamp and Osram lamp boxes travel better but I decided to prevent at least some confusion by way of stocking the different brand of lamp for the other follow spot. How many types of MSR 1200 lamps are there with some unimportant details following this info most often. Have not used an actual MSR 1200 lamp in years.
This person was asking for a MSR 700 lamp and I was sure I had some still in stock to give him for educational purposes in asking him twice what lamp he wanted. I didn't so I sent him back to ask if the department manager for moving light prep which of the two in stock MSR 700 type lamps he would prefer a MSR 700/2 or a MSD 700 lamp. (Both have different LCL's lamp center lengths by the way and won't work in one or another fixture using them.) Could be we were prepping some ancient storage trailer type moving light fixgture so if this tech was sure he needed a MSR 700 lamp I was bound and determined to give him one even if I had to buy one. Such lamps still existed as of 2003 the last time I noted them so it's possible they are still available.
So the tech person went back and asked his department manager which of the two lamps to choose. That walk back to another building often helps to inspire young professional lighting technitions to learn their lamps in also helping if just shop tech now, to learn the lamps the fixtures they prep use so once in the field and hanging under the grid that 40' in the air up side down, they know what lamp to ask the guy on the floor for. This assuming the guy on the floor even if considered a "pro" by pay scale, often ain't.
Anyway tech person later came back in requesting the MSD 700 lamps from me. (I stock both lamps these days normally for resale purposes these days to clubs using older fixtures but) I just happened to have enough in stock for him. Didn't bother signing the lamps out on the computer for him as I by now knew they were soon to come back. A guess of if the head of moving lights either was playing the game with me in training this tech person to ... "yes it said MSR 700... what else did it say" or made a guess and it will have been a wrong one given the different LCL. Still the young moving light tech took the lamps back to the department and soon returned in "them not fitting." Gee, by the way it was a MSR 700SA lamp I needed. Fun and games it might seem but an educated "professional" lighting technition that now not just knows at least one version of the lamp available for the fixture but at least knows what one lamp is best to request for it and when he hangs from the grid will hopefully have memorized the lamp in the spares box for it.
Anyway... long story short, ERS would confuse most "pros" as with proper description.
[Non-germane material moved here: http://www.controlbooth.com/forums/lighting/14282-new-led-based-ers.html]
Pro's touring or from around the shop normally call them "Lekos" if not S-4 Leko in being more proper, this as changed no doubt after the S-4 Par started getting into stock. Think it's even listed as that way also in the request/pull sheets for shows. My feling, it would confuse "the pros" if you called it a ETC S-4 ERS, this plus the remaining Colortran, Altman, and Mole Leko fixtures have been sold off or banished to my private non-existant stock/storage of them and are no longer in active inventory. Ask for a Leko, most production places I think unless CDM, Mini Ellipse or other type of special Leko only carry the S-4 at this point. Plus in requesting the Leko it's as per beam spread and 360Q's didn't do degrees of beam spread.
Pro's are also easily confused by proper terminology in my opionion at least. Only thing that got them stopped from requesting ETC lamps was me giving them ETC lamps - took about a year before that stopped for all and those "pro's learned a detail unimportant to know before. The different wattage lamps helped in that need to learn a term and define what is they need as if they use it for a living and are a professional.
I don't do shows any longer thus I take them to task in their often said example of hard life doing shows. "Ok, if you are hanging 40' in the air up side down from the grid, you are changing a lamp." Agreement that they do so as "pros" in having a hard job. I than go on once I understand their situation sufficiently. "you are calling down to some guy on the floor to get you a HTI 1200 lamp out of the spares box." Yea, ok that works for me. "You in hanging up side down in waiting for say a Mac 2K lamp in asking for a HTI 1200 lamp get a Lycian 1271 lamp." "Wouldn't it be good to memorize while hanging up side down from the grid what the lamp is called that you need?" Yes the agreement the pro should learn his or her lamps better and I am helping them - thanks ship...
Recently helped a "professional" moving light tech person in learning to remember the full lamp description - large difference between say a HTI 1200w/D7/60 and a HTI 1200w/60/P50 in stock and a few years ago when the Mac 2K lamp was a HMI 1200w/S also the HMI 1200w/GS or now HMI 1200w/DXS might come into play as a lamp choice amongst other lamps like the HMI 1200w/SE over the MSR 1200HR in being nice to the guys for different lamp code for the lamp between the two Lycian 1271 verses 1272 spots stocked. Same basic lamp and Osram lamp boxes travel better but I decided to prevent at least some confusion by way of stocking the different brand of lamp for the other follow spot. How many types of MSR 1200 lamps are there with some unimportant details following this info most often. Have not used an actual MSR 1200 lamp in years.
This person was asking for a MSR 700 lamp and I was sure I had some still in stock to give him for educational purposes in asking him twice what lamp he wanted. I didn't so I sent him back to ask if the department manager for moving light prep which of the two in stock MSR 700 type lamps he would prefer a MSR 700/2 or a MSD 700 lamp. (Both have different LCL's lamp center lengths by the way and won't work in one or another fixture using them.) Could be we were prepping some ancient storage trailer type moving light fixgture so if this tech was sure he needed a MSR 700 lamp I was bound and determined to give him one even if I had to buy one. Such lamps still existed as of 2003 the last time I noted them so it's possible they are still available.
So the tech person went back and asked his department manager which of the two lamps to choose. That walk back to another building often helps to inspire young professional lighting technitions to learn their lamps in also helping if just shop tech now, to learn the lamps the fixtures they prep use so once in the field and hanging under the grid that 40' in the air up side down, they know what lamp to ask the guy on the floor for. This assuming the guy on the floor even if considered a "pro" by pay scale, often ain't.
Anyway tech person later came back in requesting the MSD 700 lamps from me. (I stock both lamps these days normally for resale purposes these days to clubs using older fixtures but) I just happened to have enough in stock for him. Didn't bother signing the lamps out on the computer for him as I by now knew they were soon to come back. A guess of if the head of moving lights either was playing the game with me in training this tech person to ... "yes it said MSR 700... what else did it say" or made a guess and it will have been a wrong one given the different LCL. Still the young moving light tech took the lamps back to the department and soon returned in "them not fitting." Gee, by the way it was a MSR 700SA lamp I needed. Fun and games it might seem but an educated "professional" lighting technition that now not just knows at least one version of the lamp available for the fixture but at least knows what one lamp is best to request for it and when he hangs from the grid will hopefully have memorized the lamp in the spares box for it.
Anyway... long story short, ERS would confuse most "pros" as with proper description.
[Non-germane material moved here: http://www.controlbooth.com/forums/lighting/14282-new-led-based-ers.html]
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