How do you program a Martin 700 into an ETC express 48/96???

[avilicious]

I rented two martin 700 profiles from IPG and I am having trouble figuring out how to patch them into the ETC express lighting console... I couldn't find the fixture in the "personalities" menu, but do I really need that? I mean technically can I just patch the fixture manually?? And also the theater I'm working in has data inputs but can I also use the ETC link jack?? Any help would be awesome!

Thanks!!!

 

[derekleffew]

You'll find it much easier/better to use a MAC700 fixture personality, rather than patching every parameter as a dimmer. Member starksk generously provided the personalities in this thread: http://www.controlbooth.com/forums/...0-profile-personality-express-expression.html.

See also the collaborative article Programming Moving Lights on an ETC Express(ion) - ControlBooth , then come back here with specific questions.

ETC Link, if implemented, provides the console with feedback and status information from Sensor dimmers. It cannot be used to control anything. Use the DMX1 and DMX2 outputs on the console, or DMX outputs around the theatre if so equipped.

 

[avilicious]

The theater has DMX inputs and an ETC link output which I assumed was also the output. If it isn't meant for that then my question is- why does the theater only have DMX inputs and no output jacks?

You'll find it much easier/better to use a MAC700 fixture personality, rather than patching every parameter as a dimmer. Member starksk generously provided the personalities in this thread: http://www.controlbooth.com/forums/...0-profile-personality-express-expression.html.

See also the collaborative article Programming Moving Lights on an ETC Express(ion) - ControlBooth , then come back here with specific questions.

ETC Link, if implemented, provides the console with feedback and status information from Sensor dimmers. It cannot be used to control anything. Use the DMX1 and DMX2 outputs on the console, or DMX outputs around the theatre if so equipped.

 

[SteveB]

Some add'l info' as to where those DMX input connections are located would be helpful. In general, a system might be designed to have multiple DMX input locations to allow the console to be re-located, or for a visiting console to readily connect to the facility dimmers.

Anybody's guess why the theater has no additional output locations. Generally it's because the proper method to get additional DMX outputs is thru the use of an Opto-Splitter/Distribution system, that provides for isolated outputs in convenient locations. With an older system, especially with a lower end console using an Express, nobody took into consideration that 15 years later some movers, scrollers or LED's might be used and that a data distro system would be required. Just guessing at this though.

In any event, the Express does have a 2nd DMX output and if it's not used can be used to connect up to the MAC700's.

 

[kicknargel]

In addition to using the personality, I'd recommend building groups for the attributes you access frequently, and making a magic sheet to help you get the right levels. The interface on the express is pretty clunky, and a pain for accessing gobos and whatnot. I also put my CMY attributes on submasters for ease of mixing.

Also, the "update" and "only" softkeys are your friends. The syntax of "only" is a little weird, so play with it. I write a group that contains all the mover chanels except intensity. Say I have cue 1 with movers, cue 2 without and cue 3 with, but with different attributes. You can write cue 1, 2 and 3, then play back cue 2. Give it a follow equal to it's fade time. Then record cue 2.9 to match cue 2 with a time of 0. Then play back cue 3, hit update only group xx (mover attributes) cue 2.9. This will change only the mover attribute in cue 2.9, making it a mark cue.

Like I said, check the syntax--it's been a little while.

In terms of inputs/outputs, if you have no DMX outputs, you'll have to either use universe 2 off the console as mentioned, or see if you can daisy chain from your dimmer rack, if it has an output. Or get an optical isolator/splitter and put it in line just before your dimmer rack, running outputs to the rack and to the movers.

Good luck! Leave yourself lots of programming time!

 

[avilicious]

The theatre has two DMX input and ETC link outputs- one in the house under the third or fourth row and one backstage right next to the SM console. It makes a lot of sense that some theaters did not equip themselves for DMX outputs considering that this theatre was remodeled ten years ago.

Thanks for the fixture patching advice, I was able to load the personality to the board.

I get that the ETC link outputs cannot be used for data, and I think in order to solve this problem I need to run DMX from the Opto Splitter I have to the second DMX output on the board. However, I thought in order to use the second DMX output on the Express console, you needed a second universe to connect to. Would it be a problem if I directly connected the second DMX output to the Opto splitter that connects to the moving lights and gobo rotators I have? If so, while patching the fixtures would I patch it under "port" 2 instead of "port" 1?

Some add'l info' as to where those DMX input connections are located would be helpful. In general, a system might be designed to have multiple DMX input locations to allow the console to be re-located, or for a visiting console to readily connect to the facility dimmers.

Anybody's guess why the theater has no additional output locations. Generally it's because the proper method to get additional DMX outputs is thru the use of an Opto-Splitter/Distribution system, that provides for isolated outputs in convenient locations. With an older system, especially with a lower end console using an Express, nobody took into consideration that 15 years later some movers, scrollers or LED's might be used and that a data distro system would be required. Just guessing at this though.

In any event, the Express does have a 2nd DMX output and if it's not used can be used to connect up to the MAC700's.

 

[kicknargel]

Whoa, we're going down the rabbit hole a little here. So I can understand: can you spell out your current DMX path? A cable comes out of the DMX port 1 on the board and goes to. . .

 

[lorilights]

I usually use port 1 for my dimmers and port 2 for the moving lights. You can plug the moving lights together (daisy-chain) and not use the opto-splitter. You need to address the moving lights (first one should start at "1", second one depends on 16 or 32 bit but I usually use the board to program, and find it's easiest if you start first unit as 1 and second as 101 so all the numbers are the same (plus 100). Also in the board I set my second universe of DMX to start at a logical _01 after my dimmers (unless you have many hundreds of dimmers....but then, you wouldn't have an Express perhaps). I hope this helps! And plan on LOTS of time to play!!!

 

[avilicious]

So I have two MAC 700s on a catwalk position with two source fours that have Rosco's double gobo rotators in them. The two MAC 700s have data daisy chained together and plugged into the Opto splitter. The two gobo rotators are also plugged directly into the Opto splitter. The Opto splitter then has data coming out and running down the wall and into the house into the ETC link output in the house (which is looking like I will have to re run it to connect directly into the second data output on the board in the booth).

I am running an ETC Express 48/98 console. It comes with 192 usable chanels which are currently being used by the dimmers. So if I plug the data from the Opto splitter into the second DMX output on the board I should be able to re-patch the moving lights under "port two" (granted I change their address) and they should work... right?

Whoa, we're going down the rabbit hole a little here. So I can understand: can you spell out your current DMX path? A cable comes out of the DMX port 1 on the board and goes to. . .

 

[lorilights]

I am not sure how your ETC port in the house was wired... if it is already connected to port 1 through a linkage or if you have to manually plug it in - all my DMX ports terminate at the "normal" board location so I can choose - since sometimes I want it to be another location for the board (so I plug the DMX through) and sometimes I want it to connect rented dimmers to the board, or other DMX stuff (fogger, hazer, moving lights, LED fixtures). So that IS the question - is the house port already connected to your dimmer rack or is it a 2nd DMX run? Hopefully the installer knows. If not, take the board and plug it in there and see if it controls dimmers. The worst that can happen is you have to run the DMX to the board itself and plug it into Port 2. When you say "ETC link" we think you mean the phone line thing that only gives you dimmer feedback from your rack, btw. So what you need is a 5 pin DMX cable, not a phone jack. Do you mean you have 192 dimmers, and they're being controlled by your 192 channels? If yes, then you'll have to patch them down to make room for this other stuff. Or, RENT another board to control the other stuff. Haha! Isn't lighting fun!!!!

 

[derekleffew]

...When you say "ETC link" we think you mean the phone line thing that only gives you dimmer feedback from your rack, btw. So what you need is a 5 pin DMX cable, not a phone jack. ...

ETCLink is and has always been 6pin XLR.

You may be thinking of the RJ45 jack on the front of a CEM Classic, which is neither ETCLink nor Ethernet.

... The RJ45 connector on the facepanel of the CEM classic is used for configuration of the Sensor Dimming rack using a special adapter that translates between the protocol used by the rack at that port and a Windows computer. That port is neither an ethernet network interface nor a modem. Connecting a computer directly to the port will not gain you any access or feature. (And, no, you cannot connect it to a phone line for us to remotely diagnose your rack.) ...

 

[xander]

ETCLink is and has always been 6pin XLR.

You may be thinking of the RJ45 jack on the front of a CEM Classic, which is neither ETCLink nor Ethernet.

I think he is confusing ETCNet with ETCLink.

Either way. I think there is a lot of confusion in this thread. I think the OP is reversing the data flow, as it were. As DMX is a uni-directional protocol, we like to talk about the data starting at the console and disseminating from there. I think it would be helpful if the OP could give us a step-by-step description of the system. Starting from the console universe 1, and include the connector type for clarification. Pictures wouldn't hurt either.

As for channel count. I also got the impression that you have 192 dimmers. Is this so? If so, you are going to have to double patch a lot of dimmers (or just not use them all) because the console will only control 192 channels. Each attribute of the MAC will take up 1 channel. This means the two units together will take at least 32 channels, depending on mode. Your gobo rotators will also take channels. This means that to make room in the console for these channels, you would have to patch multiple dimmers to the same channel and sacrifice some individual control.

-Tim

 

[avilicious]

Thanks for all the advice. It is a little confusing but I figured it out.

I now have a new set of problems. The moving lights are working and patched into the board, but only select attributes work. For example, in order for the fixture to turn on, I have to use the strobe attribute and trick it. The strobe does work, the pan and tilt barely work, both color wheels work, the gobo wheel works, and that is it. The control Chanel isn't working the way I thought it would, the focus attribute, iris, zoom, and effects don't work whatsoever. I have no idea why only some of these are working, any one have any advice? I have the fixture set to 16 EX which may be why it's getting confused. Should I do a hard reset?

Lesson learned- Express consoles suck with moving lights

I usually use port 1 for my dimmers and port 2 for the moving lights. You can plug the moving lights together (daisy-chain) and not use the opto-splitter. You need to address the moving lights (first one should start at "1", second one depends on 16 or 32 bit but I usually use the board to program, and find it's easiest if you start first unit as 1 and second as 101 so all the numbers are the same (plus 100). Also in the board I set my second universe of DMX to start at a logical _01 after my dimmers (unless you have many hundreds of dimmers....but then, you wouldn't have an Express perhaps). I hope this helps! And plan on LOTS of time to play!!!

 

[kicknargel]

Sounds like you may have a mismatch between the device and console about whether you're using the extended or basic channel modes. If your personality is built for extended, the fixture has to be set to the same, and vice-versa.

As far as "tricking the feature with the strobe attribute" to turn it on--that's not a trick, it's how it works. Certain levels on the strobe channel send commands to turn on/off etc.

As far as pan and tilt barely working--here's one thing to check. The two small pads to the left of the touch pad toggle between course and fine motion on the touch pad. Press the top pad and then try pan and tilt, they will move faster. Press the bottom pad to get fine control on the touch pad. Also, (and this is silly) it depends on whether you have x or y highlighted on screen about which access on the touch pad they correspond to. Lastly, you can swap/invert pan and tilt in the fixture patch menu.

None of the problems you've dealt with thus far have anything to do with Express consoles sucking with moving lights. You're just dealing with learning curve in setting the system up. They're certainly not the best, but those issues come later.

 

[xander]

None of the problems you've dealt with thus far have anything to do with Express consoles sucking with moving lights. You're just dealing with learning curve in setting the system up. They're certainly not the best, but those issues come later.

Kicknargel is right. And it sounds to me like a patch issue. Either you don't have the correlating personality for the mode you are using or you have some address discrepancy. And the tips kicknargel mentioned about the trackpad are very good. To elaborate, when he mentioned which attribute is highlighted affects the trackpad, this means that which ever one you have selected (pan or tilt) will be gold and is the one that will be controlled by the x-axis and the other will be yellow and controlled by the y-axis. So, logically, you would want to select the pan whenever you want to control pan and tilt.

-Tim