new to band lighting and need advice from experts

[sonicdeluxe]

I started working with a band a few years ago. as a roadie/light man. At the time we used about a dozen par cans and 2 aggressors run to a NSI light controller for back lights and 6 chauvet LEDSplash 200b wash lights for...well...washes. Those went to a Chauvet DMX 70 light controller. They already had some chases set up so I just would put it in auto and let the chases run. About all I would do would be to adjust the speed and fade faders. That board ended up breaking so I just went online and bought a obey 70 because it was basically the same board. I have since programmed a bunch of scenes and created some chases on it for the washes. Pretty cool stuff and fairly simple to do although a color chart would help. Anyway, since then I ended up getting 2 ADJ Quad Scans and a Chauvet Hurricane Haze 2d. I still control the Quad Scan with a remote, which is very limited, but for a wedding/party band, we now have a half ass light show that can be set up quickly. We don't use the par cans at all anymore.

I am now looking at some other lights, of course, but before that I was wondering if I could get some advice on controllers. I have been looking at some DMX to USB options and wonder if it is worth it for such a small show. Also, it looks like ENTTEC would be the way to go but wondering if the ultra DMX Micro would be a reliable option (I like the price). Also, it almost seems like I would need some type of midi device to control everything easier rather than using my mouse on a laptop.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

 

[Bubby4j]

I started working with a band a few years ago. as a roadie/light man. At the time we used about a dozen par cans and 2 aggressors run to a NSI light controller for back lights and 6 chauvet LEDSplash 200b wash lights for...well...washes. Those went to a Chauvet DMX 70 light controller. They already had some chases set up so I just would put it in auto and let the chases run. About all I would do would be to adjust the speed and fade faders. That board ended up breaking so I just went online and bought a obey 70 because it was basically the same board. I have since programmed a bunch of scenes and created some chases on it for the washes. Pretty cool stuff and fairly simple to do although a color chart would help. Anyway, since then I ended up getting 2 ADJ Quad Scans and a Chauvet Hurricane Haze 2d. I still control the Quad Scan with a remote, which is very limited, but for a wedding/party band, we now have a half ass light show that can be set up quickly. We don't use the par cans at all anymore.

I am now looking at some other lights, of course, but before that I was wondering if I could get some advice on controllers. I have been looking at some DMX to USB options and wonder if it is worth it for such a small show. Also, it looks like ENTTEC would be the way to go but wondering if the ultra DMX Micro would be a reliable option (I like the price). Also, it almost seems like I would need some type of midi device to control everything easier rather than using my mouse on a laptop.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

I can tell you that the Enttec DMX USB Pro works well, I've never had any issues with it.
Whatever you do, don't get a interface which isn't buffered, because if the computer freezes, the lights freeze, and the timing in general won't be as good.

 

[sonicdeluxe]

I can tell you that the Enttec DMX USB Pro works well, I've never had any issues with it.
Whatever you do, don't get a interface which isn't buffered, because if the computer freezes, the lights freeze, and the timing in general won't be as good.

Thanks for the info. It is much appreciated. I am still a n00b when it comes to this so the more information I can get the better.

 

[AppollSauce]

I have been looking at some DMX to USB options and wonder if it is worth it for such a small show.

I'm not sure if you are still looking for a software option or not. I have been using Elation's Compu Show software for a couple of years, and before that I used their Compu Live software. You could also look up Nicol Audie's Sunlite Suite 2 software, which from what I can tell is the same as Compu Show. The basic interface for the software usually runs for about $500 but you may be able to find it cheaper.

It works great with a variety of midi controllers, a Nano Kontrol 2 from Korg is a nice $50 interface that gives you 8 faders and 8 knobs plus a good deal of buttons. It is designed for use with studio software, but it worked fine for me when I used it for lighting. I then upgraded to a Akai APC20 and eventually an Elation Midicon console.

If you don't want to use midi you can assign all of your scenes and switches to the keys on your computer keyboard, the only thing you will really need the mouse for is if you want to adjust fades, speeds, etc..

I hope you find something that works for you and your budget.

 

[gafftaper]

Welcome to Cb @sonicdeluxe! The New member forum is just for introducing yourself. I moved this thread to the lighting forum as more people will read it here.

 

[len]

There's a lot of pc options, from $ to $$$$$. Features run the gamut, too. Regardless, ask yourself how much time you want to invest in all this. Programming a bigger show will take a lot more time. Might be easier to just get someone to do the programming for you, so you can just push a button. Or better, run everything off midi so it's sync-ed and you don't worry about it. Most controllers now will have midi in.

 

[sonicdeluxe]

I'm not sure if you are still looking for a software option or not. I have been using Elation's Compu Show software for a couple of years, and before that I used their Compu Live software. You could also look up Nicol Audie's Sunlite Suite 2 software, which from what I can tell is the same as Compu Show. The basic interface for the software usually runs for about $500 but you may be able to find it cheaper.

It works great with a variety of midi controllers, a Nano Kontrol 2 from Korg is a nice $50 interface that gives you 8 faders and 8 knobs plus a good deal of buttons. It is designed for use with studio software, but it worked fine for me when I used it for lighting. I then upgraded to a Akai APC20 and eventually an Elation Midicon console.

If you don't want to use midi you can assign all of your scenes and switches to the keys on your computer keyboard, the only thing you will really need the mouse for is if you want to adjust fades, speeds, etc..

I hope you find something that works for you and your budget.

Thanks for the info. I am still looking but also trying to keep it as cost effective as possible. We are starting to get some more gigs now so I can start putting some duckies aside for an investment. I think I will try using a laptop at first, at least for some testing at home, before investing in a midi controller.

 

[sonicdeluxe]

Welcome to Cb @sonicdeluxe! The New member forum is just for introducing yourself. I moved this thread to the lighting forum as more people will read it here.

Thanks.

 

[sonicdeluxe]

There's a lot of pc options, from $ to $$$$$. Features run the gamut, too. Regardless, ask yourself how much time you want to invest in all this. Programming a bigger show will take a lot more time. Might be easier to just get someone to do the programming for you, so you can just push a button. Or better, run everything off midi so it's sync-ed and you don't worry about it. Most controllers now will have midi in.

I hear ya but the programming is what I am looking forward to. Sick I know, but......I do automation in a manufacturing plant doing PLC programming as well as robot programming (gantry, SCARA, 6-axis). Programming is kind of fun for me so I'm gonna do it. I really just need advice from experts on the best gear.

With my current Obey 70 board I have access to only 6 chases. I can create a buttload of scenes but then access to those scenes on the fly is not the easiest. I have had no issues programming on that board but some of the software I've seen is just cool as crap. I am not sure what direction I will go in just yet and I am currently dealing with some family medical emergency issues so it'll probably be a month or so before I can really focus on it.

I do appreciate all advice.

 

[len]

One other thing you want to consider is how you control, access cues you've made, etc. So ask if you can interface with a touch screen, can you assign cues, etc., to keys, can you do dmx in, can you ...? No matter how good you've programmed it, you probably want things like faders and encoder wheels, etc. to change things on the fly.

 

[sonicdeluxe]

One other thing you want to consider is how you control, access cues you've made, etc. So ask if you can interface with a touch screen, can you assign cues, etc., to keys, can you do dmx in, can you ...? No matter how good you've programmed it, you probably want things like faders and encoder wheels, etc. to change things on the fly.

Great point! The band I work with usually stays to their set-list for the first few songs of each set but since they take requests you never know what is coming up. I would love to be able to change things up on the fly more easily.

 

[TheaterEd]

I have very limited experience with My DMX, but it could work nicely for you. You wouldn't really want to build new cues on the fly with it, but you could easily build a screen of different multi-step cues and just click on whatever works for the song they decide to do. It's a bit clunky but not too bad. You can download the software for free to see if it will work for you American DJ Homepage

 

[Bubby4j]

I have very limited experience with My DMX, but it could work nicely for you. You wouldn't really want to build new cues on the fly with it, but you could easily build a screen of different multi-step cues and just click on whatever works for the song they decide to do. It's a bit clunky but not too bad. You can download the software for free to see if it will work for you American DJ Homepage

One thing to note is that MyDMX is very limiting. That's why I hate it. If you want to be able to run more than one cue at once (say, make one cue that changes the front wash to red and the cyc to green, you cant) you have to make a cue for every look you want to do. You can't save specific colors to a list of favorites, and you can't make favorite positions for movers.

If you want to hit strobe for a couple seconds, with a specific look you've already created, you can't do that on the fly. You have to duplicate the cue with the look you want, and then edit it to strobe.

Painful. But if you really want something that dead simple, then it might be for you. Anyone can use it too, barely any learning curve.

 

[TheaterEd]

One thing to note is that MyDMX is very limiting. That's why I hate it. If you want to be able to run more than one cue at once (say, make one cue that changes the front wash to red and the cyc to green, you cant) you have to make a cue for every look you want to do. You can't save specific colors to a list of favorites, and you can't make favorite positions for movers.

If you want to hit strobe for a couple seconds, with a specific look you've already created, you can't do that on the fly. You have to duplicate the cue with the look you want, and then edit it to strobe.

Painful. But if you really want something that dead simple, then it might be for you. Anyone can use it too, barely any learning curve.

I have only ever used it for programming theatrical shows, so that didn't dawn on me. I would agree with Bubby that can get pretty annoying. Best way I had was to copy the cue and then keep the parts I liked. It is very labor intensive, but I was able to program a musical on the fly during a dress rehearsal (almost decided to start smoking right there on the spot, they know now to let me know before tech week that they need an LD ).

 

[wolfman005]

Chamsys M-PC sounds like it would work well for you if your a computer minded guy. The only problem is there aren't off the shelf fader wings that are compatible with it. However I've heard of people having good success with a touchscreen. Or if you have a few thousand you can buy their fader wing. If you make this a full time thing I'd invest in one. Perhaps you could rent one just for gigs and than program without it.

As far as a USB to DMX interface, that is just as important because depending on which one you buy you will be limited on software. The open source favorite is the Enttec USB DMX Pro. Make sure you get the pro! I had the non-pro version and it would conk out when I turned on my desk lamp.

 

[AppollSauce]

One thing to note is that MyDMX is very limiting. That's why I hate it. If you want to be able to run more than one cue at once (say, make one cue that changes the front wash to red and the cyc to green, you cant) you have to make a cue for every look you want to do. You can't save specific colors to a list of favorites, and you can't make favorite positions for movers.

If you want to hit strobe for a couple seconds, with a specific look you've already created, you can't do that on the fly. You have to duplicate the cue with the look you want, and then edit it to strobe.

Painful. But if you really want something that dead simple, then it might be for you. Anyone can use it too, barely any learning curve.

I agree that MyDMX is a very limited software in terms of "on the fly" programming. Say you have a DMX controlled fog machine, and want to be able to use it at any time, in MyDMX you would have to make a copy of every scene you want to use and edit them to have the fog machine on so that you would be able to use the fogger during any scene without changing colors, intensities, etc.. If you are doing very specific cues at specific times this probably wouldn't be a big problem, but if you want to be able to react to the band changing something around or playing a request that you didn't anticipate it won't allow for any creative changes to be made quickly. This is why I prefer Elation's Compu Show software because you can have all of your scenes ready, but if you want to add a strobe, a fog burst, or any sort of change on top of the scenes you are running it is simple to do. I'm sure some of the other DMX software options have the same "on the fly" capabilites, I'm just not experienced with any of the softwares other than ADJ and Elation. MyDMX is more affordable so you can save a few bucks if you don't think you need the freedom of layering multiple scenes or looks, but I think for the extra money it is worth having the freedom.

 

[sonicdeluxe]

I agree that MyDMX is a very limited software in terms of "on the fly" programming. Say you have a DMX controlled fog machine, and want to be able to use it at any time, in MyDMX you would have to make a copy of every scene you want to use and edit them to have the fog machine on so that you would be able to use the fogger during any scene without changing colors, intensities, etc.. If you are doing very specific cues at specific times this probably wouldn't be a big problem, but if you want to be able to react to the band changing something around or playing a request that you didn't anticipate it won't allow for any creative changes to be made quickly. This is why I prefer Elation's Compu Show software because you can have all of your scenes ready, but if you want to add a strobe, a fog burst, or any sort of change on top of the scenes you are running it is simple to do. I'm sure some of the other DMX software options have the same "on the fly" capabilites, I'm just not experienced with any of the softwares other than ADJ and Elation. MyDMX is more affordable so you can save a few bucks if you don't think you need the freedom of layering multiple scenes or looks, but I think for the extra money it is worth having the freedom.

Is Compu Show free? It appears to be. I downloaded it and the manual. At the moment I am in another state caring for my parents but as soon as I get back home I can start fooling around with it. Much appreciated.

 

[AppollSauce]

Is Compu Show free? It appears to be. I downloaded it and the manual. At the moment I am in another state caring for my parents but as soon as I get back home I can start fooling around with it. Much appreciated.

The software is free, but without the interface it won't do you much good other than learning how to use the software. If I remember right, when you install the software it will start with an example show as a default. The software does have a 3d visualizer and the example show should have this already configured so that you can watch the 3d visualizer as you push buttons in the software to get an idea of what does what. I rarely use the visualizer as I usually program on site where I can actually see the lights, but it is a nice feature of the software.

As far as I know you have to have one of the Elation Compu Cue interfaces to work with the software. The software has to recognize the interface to work outside of demo mode, and I don't believe another brand of USB to DMX interface would work with this software. They have a variety of interfaces that range from a single universe to unlimited(i think..) universes, and there may also be some other bells and whistles with some of the upgraded interfaces. I noticed BillESC has posted in the classifieds " FS- Elation B Stock" where he has some B-Stock Compu Cue and Compu Cue Basic interfaces for sale. The Compu Cue Basic is being offered for $379 which is a good deal as I believe they originally sold in stores for $500. Sorry for the long winded response, but I hope all this info is of help to you.

 

[len]

Most pc-based software is free to try, and most of them free forever. But as mentioned you need hardware. Which isn't free.

As for interfaces, handles, faders, etc., if that's important then look for something that has dmx in. This opens the possibility of having fader board which can be used to control different attributes.

 

[AppollSauce]

Most pc-based software is free to try, and most of them free forever. But as mentioned you need hardware. Which isn't free.

As for interfaces, handles, faders, etc., if that's important then look for something that has dmx in. This opens the possibility of having fader board which can be used to control different attributes.

The Compu Cue interfaces have DMX in and can allow you to use a DMX controller as a physical interface for the Compu Show software. However, I find that the midi options work very well on this software and you can usually find a nice midi controller with faders and buttons for less than a DMX controller with an equivalent amount of faders and buttons. The main advantage you would have with the DMX console is you could potentially use the DMX console by itself for smaller light rigs or secondary gigs. Also, midi uses 127 values per channel, DMX uses 256. If you were to require very fine fading controls than DMX might be a better option than midi as a midi fader will usually change values two at a time instead of one.