Automated Fixtures Something similar to HES SHOWGUN under 2.4kw

lighttechie5948

Active Member
I want to use 3 Show Guns in an upcoming show but on the High End website it says that the original show gun is 2800w and the show gun 2.5 is 2500w. What can I do to get something similar, but able to safely fit on a 2.4k dimmer (hot patched of course)? (The venue is a high school and the only way to power movers is to plug them into a dimmer and hot patch the dimmer and the dimmers are 2400w.)
 
Even with a dimmer hot patched, you can't power a mover without risking blowing it up with few exceptions. Search around here to find out why... we have beaten that one to death before.

As far as "something like the showgun"...
What is it that you are trying to achieve? The showgun is a stadium fixture designed to put a lot of color/light into the air and not really light the stage. Its meant to have a 200' throw and throw as much light as possible. There are plenty of fixtures out there that are plenty bright that you can plug into a standard 20 amp outlet, which I assume you have in your venue. So... tell us what you want the effect to be and we can point you in a general direction.
 
If you are hot patching them as a nondim, just make sure you configure it as a non dim on the rack and the console and you will be fine, we run all of our 110 lights from our dimmer rack on nondim channels.

If it is not a true relay module, then this practice is less than reliable unless there is a mechanical switch that bypasses the choke. Any time the power runs through a dimmer module's electronics (regardless of what the software is telling it to do), the power still isn't suitable for a mover.

If it works for you, you're one of the lucky ones.

If you are using true relay modules, please disregard.

/dead horse beaten, again
 
If it is not a true relay module, then this practice is less than reliable unless there is a mechanical switch that bypasses the choke. Any time the power runs through a dimmer module's electronics (regardless of what the software is telling it to do), the power still isn't suitable for a mover.

If it works for you, you're one of the lucky ones.

If you are using true relay modules, please disregard.

/dead horse beaten, again

I think the bigger thing here is no matter how you are hooking it up a 208 light isn't gonna run on 120v service!
 
Depends on which light the OP gets, he could get something with a switching power supply (i know you know that, just wanted to make it clear to the op) or he could take two different phases of 110 and combine them to 208 (we do that a lot)
 
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I think the bigger thing here is no matter how you are hooking it up a 208 light isn't gonna run on 120v service!

I was just making a blanket-statement, since we determined that a ShowGun has no place in a high school theatre ;)
 
Depends on which light the OP gets, he could get something with a switching power supply (i know you know that, just wanted to make it clear to the op) or he could take two different phases of 110 and combine them to 208 (we do that a lot)

...I REALLY hope you're joking... making an adapter to plug one light into two different outlets to get 208vAC is EXTREMELY dangerous and also INCREDIBLY illegal. If one side were to come unplugged then the other side could still electrocute someone, also 208v circuits are always fed by a double pole circuit breaker. Feeding 208vAC using two SINGLE pole circuit breakers is against the NEC and can cause serious injury if only one side trips there is still power running through the overloaded circuits. If this is truly what you are doing, remind me to never go to your theatre.

Also feeding movers with a dimmer by setting it to Non-Dim is also NOT good even if you have a switch mode power supply. Unless you are using a Relay Module or a Constant Circuit Module then the power being fed to the mover would still be a modified sine wave and would cause problems. The problems may not be immediately noticed, but after a while the movers will start to fail and when you're stuff with a $3,000 bill to repair a busted mover you will wish you have just plugged it into a wall outlet. I have seen several PSU's die this way is a couple different venue's I have worked. In fact MOST manuals for movers and things of this nature explicitly say in the manual NOT to do this, in fact the only mover I know of that says you CAN do this is the ETC Source 4 Revolution, and that is because ETC specifically designed it to work off a dimmer. Martin, HES, Vari-lite and Apollo fixtures ALL say in their use manuals that you CANNOT do this with their products and that doing so will void your warranty.
 
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...I REALLY hope you're joking... making an adapter to plug one light into two different outlets to get 208vAC is EXTREMELY dangerous and also INCREDIBLY illegal. If one side were to come unplugged then the other side could still electrocute someone, also 208v circuits are always fed by a double pole circuit breaker. Feeding 208vAC using two SINGLE pole circuit breakers is against the NEC and can cause serious injury if only one side trips there is still power running through the overloaded circuits. If this is truly what you are doing, remind me to never go to your theatre.

Wow i feel like a tard now... I've always thought it was sketchy, thats that the old LD did and he said it worked. I'll be sure to clear that up next time I go in. Also we run it off a double pole though, but you have a good point about if one side gets unplugged.
 
To the OP, what exactly are you trying to accomplish. There are many different movers that your could run off a 120v 20A circuit but since the SHOWGUN isn't one of them, perhaps some additional information from you could help us give you a recommendation for a more suitable fixture for your needs. You will also need to consider what models are available from your local rental house(s).

For the record, the PRG Bad Boy offers much of the functionality and intensity of the SHOWGUN sans the LED ring and can easily be operated on 120v 20A circuits. Obviously I am not recommending an 170lb mover for a high school but I though it was an interesting sidebar.
 
If you want punchy beams, I can not suggest the Clay Packy Alpha Beam 300 more than enough. It is such a great little fixture, light weight, low power, and punchy and as fast as can be.

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In this video they are the lights on the DS edge of the deck on either side of the stage.
 
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How do you plan on paying the rental rates for the light fixtures?

Most schools can't afford more than a couple mid-to-low end movers for more than a couple weeks without really investing their entire budget into rentals, and if you end up putting a huge portion of a budget into rentals, consider at least for a few moments just how much you could buy with that much money and always have available for future shows.
 
How do you plan on paying the rental rates for the light fixtures?

Most schools can't afford more than a couple mid-to-low end movers for more than a couple weeks without really investing their entire budget into rentals, and if you end up putting a huge portion of a budget into rentals, consider at least for a few moments just how much you could buy with that much money and always have available for future shows.

I'm not sure who you think you are to be telling the OP how to spend his money. It's up to him, the TD, the teacher, principle, school board, et al to decide how and when to spend the money that they have in the budget. You have no idea the circumstances behind this financial decision, so why don't we stick to the gear and the question at hand?
 
I'm not sure who you think you are to be telling the OP how to spend his money. It's up to him, the TD, the teacher, principle, school board, et al to decide how and when to spend the money that they have in the budget. You have no idea the circumstances behind this financial decision, so why don't we stick to the gear and the question at hand?

Thanks! For the record, we are a private school, and Midsummer Night's Dream is a Shakespeare work, thus no performance rights since it is in the public domain. The costumes are all in stock, and the set costs almost nothing. So basically a majority of the budget falls to lighting. In addition, the rentals manager at the local shop is an alumni, so he is usually good to us.
 
I don't see Mike saying to consider the use of the money as telling him how to spend it.
 

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