Non-NEMA Twist-Lock

musictom

Member
Well since you all have been so helpful to this husband who is having to become my wife's light person :), I thought I'd ask yet another question:

I have some older lighting equipment at my church that we're not really using anymore, and I'd like to install them in my wife's HS theatre. The fixtures are all currently edison, and her theatre (circa 1972?) is all twist lock. So I thought it would be as simple as going to Home Depot and buying twist lock adapters, rewiring, and presto!! Wrong.

From what I can surmise, her theatre is using non-nema type twistlock receptacles. Here's a picture of what her theatre wants to see on the ends of the instruments.

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And so far, I've run out of luck finding something similar. While a rewire would be wonderful, her $100 annual budget has been frozen, so basically, if she want something for her theatre it's coming out of our pocket.

My question, would any of you have a resource I haven't yet found via google that would have these plugs available? I'd love to be able to donate some instruments, if I can switch them over from edison.

TIA!!

Tom
 
I'm fairly certain that's a Pass & Seymour 7554-SS / Hubbell 7567 equivalent.

From
7567-C Non-NEMA Locking Plug Industrial - Black-White - OneStopBuy.com

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Choice Replacement for: Hubbell Wiring 7567C, Arrow Hart AH4767, Hubbell Wiring HBL7567C, Arrow Hart AH7567N, Bryant 7568-NP, Pass & Seymour 7554-SS

Product Features:
Ground: Non-Grounding
Amperage: 15/10 Amp
Voltage: 125 Volt/250 Volt
NEMA: Non-NEMA
Pole:
3
Wire:
3
Cord Range:
.240 - .700
Wire Gauge: 18-10 AWG
Blades/Contacts:
Solid Brass
Body Material:
Super Tough Nylon
Assembly Screws: Steel, Zinc Plated
Color:
Black-White
Standards and Certifications: Non-UL
Warranty: Lifetime Warranty

You'll need to visit your friendly local electrical supply house (i.e. Graybar) or buy online (check the return policy in case I'm wrong). Prices vary widely from $12-22/each.

Since we're also talking about donated/unwanted fixtures, this collaborative article may also be useful: Lighting Fixture Maintenance.

Disclaimer:
Because this is a non-NEMA, non-UL Approved device, information is for illustrative purposes only, and does not constitute approval or recommendation by ControlBooth or myself. When in doubt, always consult a qualified professional.
 
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Sorry for budget but what's the hot verses what's the neutral? Perhaps a goal to swap all out at once or to step by step replace what you can. These need to be replaced. One pipe at a time or one fixture at a time, less a concept of buying and sustaining what's bad, more a question of what is necessary in doing. If you need parts for the old system replace it with what's proper and budget for what's proper for the entire sysem.

Eventually the entire system will be changed over and proper in a system given this concept and budgeting for such a swap over. No matter the part number for equal gear... a reason it's no longer in active service... Start the change over.
 
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Sorry for budget but what's the hot verses what's the neutral? ...
Good question. The largest blade is the ground. Of the other two, one is copper-colored, but no information as to whether copper is hot or neutral when used for 120V applications.

Hubbell Catalog page for HBL7567C.pdf
also states:
The devices shown on this page are not listed by Underwriters Laboratories Inc.
and are for replacement use only in existing installations.

Your point about converting all to something more common (perhaps such as L5-15 or even 5-15 [Edison]) is well taken.
 
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it would make sense to start a conversion. Perhaps convert where the new fixtures will be hung and make up a few adaptors, and change a few connector pairs every month or something.

At least theyre not the bakelite female 'nub out' type of 20 a twistlocks that leave a ton of hot metal exposed when the bakelite breaks from hitting the floor....
 
back in the early 70's (72 seems to be a common date i find) some state laws required twist lock connectors for facilities. i've run into this in a number of places. changing out an entire facility is quite the endevour (if i'm reading correctly some of the earlier posts). as for wiring, yes, the biggest blade is ground, and the blade at the 4 to 5 o'clock position "should" be the Neutral, but that should be indicated insdie the connector. i would think you should be able to find this connector at a home depot/lowes, etc...???
 
back in the early 70's (72 seems to be a common date i find) some state laws required twist lock connectors for facilities. i've run into this in a number of places. changing out an entire facility is quite the endevour (if i'm reading correctly some of the earlier posts). as for wiring, yes, the biggest blade is ground, and the blade at the 4 to 5 o'clock position "should" be the Neutral, but that should be indicated insdie the connector. i would think you should be able to find this connector at a home depot/lowes, etc...???

no, these connectors are not available at home centers or hardware stores.
 
... as for wiring, yes, the biggest blade is ground, and the blade at the 4 to 5 o'clock position "should" be the Neutral, but that should be indicated inside the connector. ...

So with the largest (ground) blade at 12 [the picture below shows it at 7-9], the non-copper blade at 4-5 is the "neutral," and the copper blade is "hot"?
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For fixtures using bipin or bi-post bases, hot and neutral are interchangeable at the connector, but for circular sockets (screwbase and prefocus for instance) the center contact should be wired to the "hot" connector terminal.

musictom, take apart one, or several, of the existing plugs and let us know if this is accurate. The "rules" in the circa 1972 facility in question may be different; after all they used a non-NEMA connector, so may not have been that diligent some thirty-eight years ago.:( In any case, everyone will learn something.:)


See above post for disclaimer.
 
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So with the largest (ground) blade at 12 [the picture below shows it at 7-9], the non-copper blade at 4-5 is the "neutral," and the copper blade is "hot"?
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For fixtures using bipin or bi-post bases, hot and neutral are interchangeable at the connector, but for circular sockets (screwbase and prefocus for instance) the center contact should be wired to the "hot" connector terminal.

musictom, take apart one, or several, of the existing plugs and let us know if this is accurate. The "rules" in the circa 1972 facility in question may be different; after all they used a non-NEMA connector, so may not have been that diligent some thirty-eight years ago.:( In any case, everyone will learn something.:)


See above post for disclaimer.

There is nothing inherently unsafe about this non-NEMA connector, and the Hubbell catalog says it all: for replacement in existing facilities.

The NEMA rating is designed to guarantee interoperability and a common dimension to each NEMA type. That is probably not all that important here, since it will presumably be rare that "guest" fixtures will have to mate with the system.

There is no Code requirement that requires wholesale connector replacement in a facility to bring it current, since the applicable NEC was the one in force at the time of construction.

However, if the budget allows and the connector count is not absurdly high, this might be a good opportunity to bring the facility up to a current connector.

ST
 
... I'd love to be able to donate some instruments, if I can switch them over from edison.
Perhaps the, limited, budget could best be used to build a handful of (male)HBL7567 - (female)Edison adapters, rather than converting all the "donated" fixtures to 7567?
 
Generally, the silver colored screw is neutral and the copper/brass one is hot. (One must also assume that someone may have taken the screws all the way out (hard but can be done) so look at 2 or 3 of them ;) )
 
Generally, the silver colored screw is neutral and the copper/brass one is hot. (One must also assume that someone may have taken the screws all the way out (hard but can be done) so look at 2 or 3 of them ;) )

I've taken several apart, and it is, indeed as you say: silver is neutral; brass is hot.

While it would be nice to convert over, frankly that's the least of their worries. This poor theatre has been so neglected, that a conversion would probably be about #12-15 on the list. Just a few par cans out in front to give an even wash of the stage at this point would be a luxury. :) Right now, her front lighting consists of one par can, two OLD 360Qs (the ones with the mottled brown finish and the "fabric" power cables), and 4 fresnels of varying sizes and wattage. I have some "newer" (circa 1993) Altman Lekos I was wanting to convert and hang, just so she'd actually have at least a couple of zones she could control. Well, that's assuming that nobody flips a breaker, and her 2 scene controller loses its DMX memory, hehe!! And with an annual budget of $0, (her $100 annual budget has been frozen due to district cuts), it's hard to get excited about switching over connectors.

I could go on, but I'm sure everybody's been in this place before. I'm not whining — hey, my wife has a job, and she's able to get kids excited about theatre! And she doesn't have to perform in a cafeteria! Eventually, hopefully, things will get up to speed. I know it's a lot more than many, many people have to work with, for which she's quite grateful.

Thanks again for all the great replies!! Most appreciated!

Tom
 
I'm not whining — hey, my wife has a job, and she's able to get kids excited about theatre! And she doesn't have to perform in a cafeteria!

AMEN to that! Mines a HS English teacher at a private school that is going through reductions...
 
AMEN to that! Mines a HS English teacher at a private school that is going through reductions...

Sounds like a fund raiser concept to me. This and also if proper at least maintaining of the equipment is a problem possibly also at least giving some on your own. Assuming the school approves of such efforts of course. More fixtures etc. Interesting there was a marked hot/neutral ground screw on it, normally not.

From my windmil topic a few months ago in getting local buisinesses involved to in the long past lots of discussions many of us have given ideas for in getting fund raising dollars and manpower beyond the bake sale there is ideas out there to save money and raise funds. Take time and a lot of effort of course but if the goal is noble the goal can be done often with extra effort already shown an intent for.

Should also be able to get a tax donation for the nickle and dime stuff I'm sure you are already providing. Sorry, don't mean in the above to imply that you are not already doing all you can to sustain this program. This in days of programs being cut and going down to four day weeks. Hard work you and your wife as with others teaching should be thanked for doing all you can to bring up the next generation.
 
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Might be hard to get people excited about a fund raiser for plugs so why not go for some new lights as a goal! (When describing the fundraiser, also indicate it will help buy new plugs for the current fixtures as well.)
 
Pfft, if it comes to buying new plugs (which I don't yet believe is actually necessary), you can call it a fundraiser for an electrical upgrade, people will nod and smile, and so on and such forth.

It's hard to justify spending on the money on something that doesn't actually improve the functionality of the facility or the quality of productions.
 
Pfft, if it comes to buying new plugs (which I don't yet believe is actually necessary), you can call it a fundraiser for an electrical upgrade, people will nod and smile, and so on and such forth.

It's hard to justify spending on the money on something that doesn't actually improve the functionality of the facility or the quality of productions.

It's hard to justify spending on the money on something that doesn't actually improve the functionality of the facility or the quality of productions.[/QUOTE]


Agreed if there is other more pressing things on the safety side and nobody but those qualified wire the plugs given they are gold verses silver terminals. Never seen a Non-NEMA rated at 125/250V with other than gold/gold but on the other hand I believe most Non-NEMA plugs I have seen are 120/240V so perhaps I'm wrong. I don't have the catalogues or chart at home.

If there is a gold vs. silver terminal, could wait, if not and really needed to wait, I would normally follow the Hot towards Hook H/H standard as easy to remember and silver/black sharpee the terminal screws. This for any connector or other than bi-pin lamp where it don't matter. It is a safety thing for pre-focus and screw based lamps in getting hot/neutral correct. Also if the house is panel mount, changing the plugs wouldn't be a cheap fix, even if whip, cord mount receptacles are not cheap either. At this point if most of the inventory is Edison, I would stick with Edison unless twist lock panel mount for the distribution about the theater in which case eiher L5-15 or L5-20 would be best. This or single outlet Edison if the same punch hole. Edison is rated for use in theaters in the US though 20A if your dimmers are such. A Green Lee punch to go L5-20R if needed if your dimmers are rated for 20A. Perhaps ten year plan in getting done. Concern also that if the dimmers are 20A, could be problematic if receptacles are only 15A. NEC old wiring code also don't apply to schools so they can do what ever they want and no doubt what don't get brought to their attention in noting will be fine if they don't have to budget to fix.

So perhaps put the upgrade on the five year plan or one by one in getting the fixtures fixed first and perhaps another few fixtures needed to the inventory. Don't think there are any $25.00 Rock and Roll cans with lamp still being sold on the market - the PAR 64 came back recently, but one can at least find some fairly cheap still as potentially an option.

Feel kind of bad in me just getting a Century 8" Fresnel today that while it will need a total rewiring and service call (rust pot it is inside and wired by 18/3 zip cord with plug's ground removed,) once cleaned up and re-wired it's only to be added to the inventory of antiques and unless there is another show wanting antiques, this fixture will probably never get used again like the rest of my inventory, this until I retire and have more time to do shows say 25 or 30 years from now. By than LED's, CFL's and Plazma wil no doubt be the bulk of most stage lighting and I'll be considered a crumudgen in designing with such fixtures. Already at work, most of the fixture fabriction I do is with some LED fixture or belt light or another.

In buying another fixture I woud probably stick with the E-Bay type used fixtures and even keep to what type is already in the inventory especially part and lamp type wise. No reason to introduce another part or lamp type into your inventory unless say GLA or GLE on a one by one basis for more punch or better gobo use. Inspect thoroughly and expect you will need to do a lot of work to what ever is bought used. Cheaper to keep to a few lamps than many lamp types on a budget if you stick with types of stuff you already have. Perhaps upgrade the lamps one by one for more punch and less wattage as a cheaper improvement lamp plan for now. Might even go Eiko, PEC or Divine amongst a few cheaper brands for now to sustain the inventory a while for the line lamps. (Might avoid the cheaper lamps for RSC and Bayonet dual pin types as the name brands seem to be much better at least for them overall in a quick failure or base destroying type of way.)

Also, make sure the dimmers are trimmed to 90% so as to save on lamp life. Proably a good investment to get the dimmers looked at and perhaps the board cleaned in that you can loose a light in a show but loosing a dimmer and light board is really bad - no matter what it is.

Long run cheaper lamps will no doubt cost more in needing to replace lampholders more - watch them pins as evidence as to what the lampholder also looks like and you might go thru more lamps than normal, also upgrading to say GLA might not be available yet in the other lamp versions but for five year sustainability of what you have, such concepts might free up some in budget to get what you have healthy. After that sustain it and build on it and or swap out the plugs much less no doubt cable is getting old also etc. Sustain for the next few years perhaps as the five year plan and developing that plan very important.
 
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