LED Lighting Questions for Purchase

From what I have seen the Ovation E-910FC actually produced quite a decent white and has the option to change the color temperature on it. I would recommend doing a demo though.

To save money I would recommend finding a fixture that color mixes and does a decent white as well.
 
Looking at both your vendors, the Avolites console and Ovation units vs. the ETC console and units, I think your second vendor is much more understanding of theatrical needs, but with regards to budget, the Ovations are cheaper than the ETC LED units.

It does make sense, however, to have a paired front wash - one white, one color-adjustable, because if I understand right, you don't have ready access to the instruments on a daily basis. If it's hard to reach the instruments, you're already limited in the 'improve the shows' aspect because you are then stuck with a house plot for all the different sets you might have. But if that's the case, you can have one light for front white light and one for color, so you can blend them and get whatever look you want. If you can access the FOH instruments, it's worthwhile to use the white instruments and gel them as needed - treat them as you would a standard unit.

I think you should see if you can find a local person with more experience who could review the proposals while actually looking at the space and having a conversation with you about your needs... much though Control Booth is helpful, without knowing the program and your space and actually seeing it or looking at a 3D model, I think you need more expert (and unbiased) advice.
 
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Looking at both your vendors, the Avolites console and Ovation units vs. the ETC console and units, I think your second vendor is much more understanding of theatrical needs, but with regards to budget, the Ovations are cheaper than the ETC LED units.

It does make sense, however, to have a paired front wash - one white, one color-adjustable, because if I understand right, you don't have ready access to the instruments on a daily basis. If it's hard to reach the instruments, you're already limited in the 'improve the shows' aspect because you are then stuck with a house plot for all the different sets you might have. But if that's the case, you can have one light for front white light and one for color, so you can blend them and get whatever look you want. If you can access the FOH instruments, it's worthwhile to use the white instruments and gel them as needed - treat them as you would a standard unit.

I think you should see if you can find a local person with more experience who could review the proposals while actually looking at the space and having a conversation with you about your needs... much though Control Booth is helpful, without knowing the program and your space and actually seeing it or looking at a 3D model, I think you need more expert (and unbiased) advice.

Thank you for the input! I am looking around for some lighting design professionals outside of the vendors for some assistance. I couldn't figure out the whole white then a color, but thank to the helpful posters here, I have learned a little bit!

The ETC vendor is someone I've worked with for over ten years, while the Ovation vendor is someone who wants to make my space a reference space for their company. I have my preferences, but so does the rest of the decision makers at my school.

Now that my show is over, it's time to get down to the nitty gritty on these proposals.
 
So, I am nearing the close of this particular project. I have couple of detail questions.

On the Chauvet fixtures, I have heard that the Chauvet stops supporting and maintaining parts after it's become obsolete. I've also read that they are difficult to repair. I couldn't really handle them during the demo alas. Also, they seem to be the same-ish price as the ColorSource Spots.

The Chauvet vendor is also really pushing the PC to DMX route (using ShowXpress at their demo). Would this prepare my students for anything? Like can the skills they get using the ShowXpress on a PC translate into anything? All the colleges and universities in my area are ETC houses. I do not see how it could translate for anything other than setting up their own DJ set or rad dorm room in college.

So basically, I keep trying to talk myself into giving the Chauvet based system a shot. At the demo, the kids loved how easy it was to play with the moving lights. I can see it being just as easy on a dedicated board too. I am also trying not to force my 2000ish based education on them at the expense of something newer and better. I just don't really believe it's better.

I got back to what I can tell parents about my program. If I go the PC/Chauvet: We can train your kids to use moving lights and LEDs on a PC based console. If I go ETC: We can train your kids to use that same equipment in professional theatre. Again, I really feel like ETC gives my kids the tools they need to go work in colleges, studios, and professional theatres.

Am I being fair?
 
You can do a PC based ETC control with Nomad. Far more expensive than Chauvet as you might expect.

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk
 
I can understand your position as an educator as well as a steward of the school's finances. Once a product becomes obsolete (and the matter is not if, it's when), you will likely be asked why parts are unavailable. It stands to reason that specific parts for anything, ie: toasters, cell phones, lawn mowers, and yes lighting equipment, will eventually run out. Completely. This portion of your question seems to answer itself.


<I got back to what I can tell parents about my program. If I go the PC/Chauvet: We can train your kids to use moving lights and LEDs on a PC based console. If I go ETC: We can train your kids to use that same equipment in professional theatre. Again, I really feel like ETC gives my kids the tools they need to go work in colleges, studios, and professional theatres.

Am I being fair? >

I believe you are being fair. You are bridled with the responsibility of training high school students for a variety of scenarios, perhaps higher education in local schools and potentially an occupation working in a studio or theatre. Or perhaps one of these students will be doing exactly what you're doing right now, in 10 years- being responsible.

You've brought a lot to the table and it's worth taking time to make a good decision. Let us know what you choose to do-
 
So, I am nearing the close of this particular project. I have couple of detail questions.

On the Chauvet fixtures, I have heard that the Chauvet stops supporting and maintaining parts after it's become obsolete. I've also read that they are difficult to repair. I couldn't really handle them during the demo alas. Also, they seem to be the same-ish price as the ColorSource Spots.
...
I got back to what I can tell parents about my program. If I go the PC/Chauvet: We can train your kids to use moving lights and LEDs on a PC based console. If I go ETC: We can train your kids to use that same equipment in professional theatre. Again, I really feel like ETC gives my kids the tools they need to go work in colleges, studios, and professional theatres.

It is difficult for me to give an unbiased answer... as I am the SR Product Manager at Chauvet, but Let me make a couple of points, and Hope that they will help you with your decision.
BTW, before this, I was the Master Electrician at Cornell University for about 10 years, and trained the students at Trumansburg central schools on their ETC consoles (and followspots, and other gear that they got in for their annual musicals). I am a fan of ETC. They are a great company. I have used and recommended their controllers for decades.

Fixtures:
The E190 (white light) is great, but if you are going to use this space for everything from talent shows, to theatrical productions, to a pep rally, to your basket ball games, to a Halloween haunted house... save yourself the hassle, and just get the Color units, and let the changes be made from the ground, at the console, rather than needing to get out a lift (are your students allowed in them?), and having to mess with the net or cage system to get access to the fixtures. If you have the color fixtures, you will use them more, because it will be far easier to do so.

That said...
The E910 (COLOR) is more comparable to the ETC LUSTR series in terms of level of control, than to the COLORSource units. However, you are correct that the pricing is very similar to the COLORSource.
The E910's built-in whites, and Virtual Color Wheel give you the option of quick, easy color selection.
If you want precision, or to use a console's color picker you can mix the Red, Green, Blue, Amber and Lime individually, in 8-bit, or 16-bit control for more precise control.
This also allows you to get very saturate colors.

ETC COLORSource has DMX channels for Intensity, Red, Green, and Blue, and then automatically adds the Lime. From the ETC manual:
The fixture listens to RGB but
interprets color output using the full
RGB-L array. It is not possible to
control a single group of LEDs; i.e.
only blue.

If you are looking for general color wash units, then I would not recommend Ellipsoidal style fixtures at all. Especially in a Gymnasium, where (no matter how hard you try to protect them) it is likely that at some point they are going to get whacked by a ball (tennis, basketball, kickball, or even football or Frisbee). I'd look for something without shutters, and compact. If you want zoom, to vary beam angle, you could look at the COLORado 1 Quad Zoom (Quad-color RGBW color mixing), or COLORado 1 SOLO (single source RGBW). If you don't need zoom, you could go as inexpensive as the COLORado 1 Tri Tour (Tri-color RGB only), or for more color options you could go with the COLORDash S-Par (Single Source RGBA color mixing).

For Control... this is really up to you. ShowXpress is extremely easy to learn and program, but follow's the control logic of a Busking controller, like LightJockey. Your students will pick it up very quickly. They will be able to control lights "on the fly" for the non-theatrical events, but it doesn't use a timing/cue based philosopy, like your typical theatrical controller.


If you're looking to control cost, and cannot afford a full console, but want something more "console like" than ShowXpress, then there are a lot of options out there.
A Few are:
The AVO TitanONE gives you 100 DMX Channels on a computer emulated console (same look and feel as their full size consoles) for about $100. I believe that they may have replaced it with a TitanTwo (200 channel, I don't know the cost, but would guess that it's about $200). They have incredible customer service (Hi Brad & Jim). but you're getting less than half a universe of DMX, so it may, or may not work for you.
CHAMSYS makes a variety of levels of software based controllers, and you can choose the interface to look more theatrical, or more "Whole-Hog-y". Their support is also good, although they are a smaller operation in the US.
Ma Lighting DOT 1. Similar to the Avo Titan, but with the Grand Ma interface. I have little experience with the Grand Ma customer service, but their consoles are used widely in the industry.
NOMAD... Pretty much what Rick R said, above...with ETC support.

You mention that the Colleges around you use ETC for control. Are they running the old Expressions, or one of the newer consoles (Element, Ion, etc.)? In my experience, ETC used to own about 75% or more of the theatrical controllers. Over the last several years, a lot of professional theatres have moved to consoles like the GrandMA, WholeHOG, or similar. I have seen more of these in collegiate programs that have upgraded their controllers recently. If your students go to work in event lighting (other than theatre), they are likely to encounter consoles like these, rather than a theatrical controller.

I would also take a look at the Jands CL line of controllers. If you are looking for intuitive, and simple, they have it nailed.

Finally, ETC just launched their COLORSOURCE controller. I have no experience with it, but it may be worth putting your Google-Fu to use to check it out.


I hope this helps with your decision.
-Ford
 

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